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#1 SZY

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 12:19 AM

Hi, can anyone help me on this topic?
Should i blend everything into a paste?

Thanks in advance.


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#2 faisal rafique

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 04:37 AM

Hi, can anyone help me on this topic?
Should i blend everything into a paste?

Thanks in advance.


Dear,
Yes, you are in right direction.
Take 5 or 10 gm sample, add same quantity of distilled water, blend in blender and measure pH with meter.

Faisal Rafique
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#3 Dr Ajay Shah

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 06:03 AM

Hi SZY,

What Faisal Rafique has mentioned is absolutely correct. Instead of using a pH Meter one can also use pH indicato paper with a braod range to begin with and then use a more specific range to get more accuracy.

I hope this helps you.

Regards

Ajay Shah

:smarty:


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#4 Alicia.KPL

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 12:04 PM

At our facility we blend 25g salad, and 25g distilled water (the potato salads we have found it works better 50g/50g), blend them for 60 seconds, then we measure pH with both a handheld meter and a table top one to make sure we are getting an accurate reading.

I know this doesn't add much, but thought it might be useful!


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#5 SZY

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 10:04 PM

Thank you, guys. I appreciate for your help.
Your information is really helpful to me.


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#6 bigkev

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Posted 09 March 2011 - 03:16 AM

Hi, can anyone help me on this topic?
Should i blend everything into a paste?

Thanks in advance.


Hi SZY,

Forming a puree is not the right way to do it as this will give you a distorted high result.

I was Food Technnologist for All States Food Service which was the biggest salad manufacturer in Australia supplying major retail chains.
Salad pH is difficult to measure but not impossible.
Firstly the pH will equilibrate over the first 5 days after manufacture. i.e. it will go up as the acid is absorbed and buffering and microbial activities occur.
You need to measure the pH every day for the first 5 days to be sure what is happening with each of your salad types.
You will need to give you pH meter/electrode time to find its highest value.......does not change for 20-30 seconds.
I offsett the rise in pH in our salads by adding extra acid. You cannot just add any acid as this will make the product too tart.I recommend you use 90% lactic acid (which has a soft acid taste) in addition to your standard citrics & acetics to target a day 5 pH of 4.2 maximum.
The pH electrode will need to be regularly cleaned and buffered to ensure the readings are true and as responsive as possible. Careful effort is neede to ensure no buffer cross contamination and that buffers are fresh and changed often (buffer tables are great for this)We found that a soak in 0.1M HCl was necessary each week to avoid biofilm forming on the glass.



Please let me know if you need help with technologies I developed e.g. removing pathogens and extending shelf life beyond 7 days!
regards,
Kevin Woodman
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#7 FSSM

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Posted 09 March 2011 - 06:42 PM

Hi SZY,

Forming a puree is not the right way to do it as this will give you a distorted high result.

I was Food Technnologist for All States Food Service which was the biggest salad manufacturer in Australia supplying major retail chains.
Salad pH is difficult to measure but not impossible.
Firstly the pH will equilibrate over the first 5 days after manufacture. i.e. it will go up as the acid is absorbed and buffering and microbial activities occur.
You need to measure the pH every day for the first 5 days to be sure what is happening with each of your salad types.
You will need to give you pH meter/electrode time to find its highest value.......does not change for 20-30 seconds.
I offsett the rise in pH in our salads by adding extra acid. You cannot just add any acid as this will make the product too tart.I recommend you use 90% lactic acid (which has a soft acid taste) in addition to your standard citrics & acetics to target a day 5 pH of 4.2 maximum.
The pH electrode will need to be regularly cleaned and buffered to ensure the readings are true and as responsive as possible. Careful effort is neede to ensure no buffer cross contamination and that buffers are fresh and changed often (buffer tables are great for this)We found that a soak in 0.1M HCl was necessary each week to avoid biofilm forming on the glass.



Please let me know if you need help with technologies I developed e.g. removing pathogens and extending shelf life beyond 7 days!
regards,
Kevin Woodman


Hi,

Just to kill my ignorance, what is pH used for in a salad? Is there any regulation that asks for this test in that kind of product?

Regards,

FSSM
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#8 Tony-C

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Posted 10 March 2011 - 04:37 PM

Hi SZY,

I offsett the rise in pH in our salads by adding extra acid. You cannot just add any acid as this will make the product too tart.I recommend you use 90% lactic acid (which has a soft acid taste) in addition to your standard citrics & acetics to target a day 5 pH of 4.2 maximum.
regards,
Kevin Woodman


I assume that you are saying that your salads are/were treated with acid to pH protect them. In which case are we talking about fresh produce or processed products?

Regards,

Tony
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#9 SZY

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 01:01 AM

Hi SZY,

Forming a puree is not the right way to do it as this will give you a distorted high result.

[/quote]


Hi, Kelvin

If forming a puree is not the right way, what should i do to process the salad before test?

Thank you


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#10 SZY

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 01:03 AM

Hi,

Just to kill my ignorance, what is pH used for in a salad? Is there any regulation that asks for this test in that kind of product?

Regards,

FSSM



Hi, FSSM

In Australia, required by Food Standard, all fresh veggies and fruit products must have a pH reading not above 4.6
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#11 SZY

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 01:04 AM

I assume that you are saying that your salads are/were treated with acid to pH protect them. In which case are we talking about fresh produce or processed products?

Regards,

Tony



Hi, Tony

We are making fresh veggie salads.

Edited by SZY, 17 March 2011 - 01:06 AM.

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#12 Charles.C

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 05:05 PM

Dear SZY,

In Australia, required by Food Standard, all fresh veggies and fruit products must have a pH reading not above 4.6


Interesting. I presume you mean chemically untreated (other than water i suppose ?).

Not my specialisation but yr (general) quote is rather surprising to me, do you hv a link to this statement?

Rgds / Charles.C
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Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


#13 Tony-C

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 05:37 PM

Hi, FSSM

In Australia, required by Food Standard, all fresh veggies and fruit products must have a pH reading not above 4.6


I just like this so much I feel the need to put a few icons in:

:rolleyes: :unsure: :wacko: :doh: :beam: :blahblah: :whistle: :ejut: :oops2: :roflmao:

http://www.engineeri...d-ph-d_403.html
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#14 SZY

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Posted 18 March 2011 - 12:55 AM

Dear SZY,



Interesting. I presume you mean chemically untreated (other than water i suppose ?).

Not my specialisation but yr (general) quote is rather surprising to me, do you hv a link to this statement?

Rgds / Charles.C


Hi, Charles

http://www.foodstand..._&_Veg_v107.pdf

Please check the link attached.

SZY
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#15 Charles.C

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Posted 18 March 2011 - 09:05 PM

Dear SZY,

Thks for the link.

Unfortunately (eg see the “composition” text) I think this document has no intended connection to fresh salads within the context of the current thread.

The cross-referenced 1.3.1 which primarily focuses on additives is also rather confusing in the current thread’s pH context, a more relevant document (IMO) (but not to fresh salads! :smile: ) is probably this -

Attached File  australian food standards - shelf-stable-acid-preserved-foods.pdf   174.15KB   8 downloads
(see page 2)

Rgds / Charles.C

PS the above attachment gives a, claimed, good reference to pH measurement but I didn't follow it up (maybe not for fresh salad)

PPS I also agree there are some confusing (Australian) websites around on this general topic, eg -

http://www.marketfre...ble_flowers.asp
(eg see FS paragraph)


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Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


#16 Tony-C

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Posted 20 March 2011 - 11:41 AM

Hi, Charles

http://www.foodstand..._&_Veg_v107.pdf

Please check the link attached.

SZY


From the attachment:

2 Composition

Fruit and vegetables in brine, oil, vinegar or water, other than commercially canned fruit and vegetables, must not have a pH greater than 4.6.</B>

These are not requirements for fresh fruit and vegetables and it seems to me that you have been sidetracked by this pH requirement when it is most likely that there is no pH requirement.

Regards,

Tony
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#17 SZY

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Posted 20 March 2011 - 11:59 PM

Dear SZY,

Thks for the link.

Unfortunately (eg see the “composition” text) I think this document has no intended connection to fresh salads within the context of the current thread.

The cross-referenced 1.3.1 which primarily focuses on additives is also rather confusing in the current thread’s pH context, a more relevant document (IMO) (but not to fresh salads! :smile: ) is probably this -

Attached File  australian food standards - shelf-stable-acid-preserved-foods.pdf   174.15KB   8 downloads
(see page 2)

Rgds / Charles.C

PS the above attachment gives a, claimed, good reference to pH measurement but I didn't follow it up (maybe not for fresh salad)

PPS I also agree there are some confusing (Australian) websites around on this general topic, eg -

http://www.marketfre...ble_flowers.asp
(eg see FS paragraph)



Hi, Cherles

Actually, the statement in Australia is quite confusing. If you read through the standard shelf-stable-acid-preserved-foods, yes, there is no requirement for fresh salads, only the pH of the sauces need to be below 4.6. However, as you can see from the food standard 2.3.1, 'Fruit and vegetables in brine, oil, vinegar or water, other than commercially canned fruit and vegetables, must not have a pH greater than 4.6.', people can have a different understand to this statement, because salads is actually in combined solution of brine,oil or vinegar. And it's hard to argue it with Food Authority and external auditor when they all ask us to show the evidence that our salads don't have a pH reading beyond 4.6.

SZY
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#18 Charles.C

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Posted 21 March 2011 - 10:44 PM

Dear SZY,

I think you underestimate Australian auditors. :smile:
I suppose you could always offer a free handout of Tony’s nice table with every order of yr shrimp salad containing cabbage / carrot / egg and shrimp. :biggrin:

Rgds / Charles.C


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Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C





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