10 replies to this topic

[qui]

Hi, 

 

I believe that when in a step of the process there is a Microbial Growth due to temperature uncontrolled, it must be a CCP, because the Severity will be 1 or 2 ( fatality or customer illness) and the likelihood is also B or C, specifically I am talking about Distribution for frozen products, where the temperature is critical.

 

What do you reckon?

 

Thanks!!!

 

Quimica

[andycuk7]

ccp all day however dependant on the product and customer usage

[andycuk7]

what product is it ??

[George @ Safefood 360°]

Not necessarily so. Depending on the model of risk assessment you use it is the significance of of the hazard that will determine whether it should be assessed as a CCP to being with. Not all hazards have the same significance. Risk is probability of occurrence x severity of impact. A medium or high risk (significance) will then force you to conduct a CCP determination based on CODEX principles. For example the probability of a frozen product heating up to temperatures in the storage and supply chain may be low since it can take time and preventive measures may alert you long before this happens allowing you take corrective action. It will also depend on the specific target pathogens subject of the risk assessment. The growth characteristics, lethal dose etc of one organism are not the same as another. I am aware of many companies who have temperature storage as a PRP and not a CCP based on their assessment of risk.

 

I hope this helps you a little. 

 

George

[qui]

I have frozen pastries, and on the Distribution Step, talking about Hazard Analysis, if the temperature goes up it lead into a Microbial Growth that can cause illness in consumers therefore there will be a significance. 

I understand that the severity is calculated thinking of " if there isnt any control measure, will it likely to happen?" so it is if the product temperature isnt less than -18 celsius degrees, the product will spoil. So that's my reason to set here a CCP, but not sure if Im right

[Charles.C]

I have frozen pastries, and on the Distribution Step, talking about Hazard Analysis, if the temperature goes up it lead into a Microbial Growth that can cause illness in consumers therefore there will be a significance. 

I understand that the severity is calculated thinking of " if there isnt any control measure, will it likely to happen?" so it is if the product temperature isnt less than -18 celsius degrees, the product will spoil. So that's my reason to set here a CCP, but not sure if Im right

Dear Quimica,

 

It is possible you are misunderstanding the meaning / usage of "significance", severity, safety-related hazards.

 

I suggest you r-read George's summary in previous post. And have a look at the classic Codex / NACMCF haccp

publications.

 

What is the critical limit you have set for yr product pastry, core temperature during distribution. ?

 

I assume you are monitoring the critical temperature during distribution. Where, when and how ? How often does the temperature fail the critical limit and by how much ?

 

Rgds / Charles.C

[qui]

Maybe I didn't explain it clearly, sorry.

I am doing the Hazard Analysis Checklist, and in the the process step: Distribution, there is a Microbial Growth Hazard, due to a temperature control if goes up to -18 degrees, so I need to find out whether it is significant or not using the Hazard Analysis Matrix (Advanced Food Safety Source), so I consider a Severity level of 2, because can cause an illness in consumers if the temperature goes up, and a likelihood of C, coz it could occur, therefore the significant it's 8, which means it's  a significant hazard, and I set the control measures.

[Charles.C]

Dear Quimica,

 

No problem.

 

It is a fact that although textbooks sometimes tend to imply that Hazard Analyses are simply a case of following a menu, in fact they demand a detailed understanding of a process and the consequence of any safety related errors (eg BCPA) due to "likely" hazards.

 

I have attached a typical risk matrix which includes some generic instructions / comments. Maybe you can try applying it to yr situation ?. If anything unclear, welcome to revert.

 

 Use of Risk Matrix in Hazard Analyses,1.c.xls   56.5KB   105 downloads

 

Rgds / Charles.C

Edited by Charles.C, 22 October 2013 - 07:08 AM.
edited excel

[Mathieu Colmant]

Dear Quimica,

 

Your product is frozen pastries. From what i understand in those two words, i will assume : 

- that the product is quite dry. What is the water activity of your product ? is it below or above the minimal aw for bacterial growing ?

Typically, on pastries, you will find funghi growth, not bacteria.

- that the product is stored and maintained at -18°C. What is the risk that the product comes to a temperature that allow bacterial growth ?

If the temperature is correctly monitored, you maybe will have a product at -15°C, when alarms will warn you that there is a problem. But you still have time to react. This step is not strictly a CCP, because there is no chance that the risk will grow enough to cause illness.

However, you probably have a legal requirement, so you need to respect this temperature and prove it. You will thus follow same rules as a CCP.

 

Kind regards

Mathieu Colmant

VeilleAlim.eu sprl

[qui]

Dear Quimica,

 

Your product is frozen pastries. From what i understand in those two words, i will assume : 

- that the product is quite dry. What is the water activity of your product ? is it below or above the minimal aw for bacterial growing ?

Typically, on pastries, you will find funghi growth, not bacteria.

- that the product is stored and maintained at -18°C. What is the risk that the product comes to a temperature that allow bacterial growth ?

If the temperature is correctly monitored, you maybe will have a product at -15°C, when alarms will warn you that there is a problem. But you still have time to react. This step is not strictly a CCP, because there is no chance that the risk will grow enough to cause illness.

However, you probably have a legal requirement, so you need to respect this temperature and prove it. You will thus follow same rules as a CCP.

 

Kind regards

Mathieu Colmant

VeilleAlim.eu sprl

 Thanks Mathieu, 

The water activity is quite high is some of the products, up to 0.9, and the storage is at -20 °C. 

I have this  HACCP training and I was told that when temperature is a critical limit usually the hazard becomes a CCP, but you right because the Storage and the Distribution is under a contractor, and their facilities are optimal.

 

very useful answer!!! cheers

[Charles.C]

Dear Quimica,

 

If you are not too satisfied with doing risk analyses for this stage, you might consider adopting the Canadian HACCP approach where transportation of finished products is considered within the Prerequisite programs. For example, see  –

 

http://www.inspectio...82?chap=4#a3112

 

If you wish some idea for acceptable temperature deviations, can see this Codex document -

 Codex - CXP_008e.pdf   119.42KB   76 downloads

(note that this reference leaves the HACCP status “open”)

 

Just as a safety-related, side-comment, you might cogitate over the likelihood of microbial, pathogenic growth occurring in a refrigerated truck transporting frozen product at approx. -18degC  if the product temperature rose to, say, -10degC ? -5degC?

 

Of course it's even easier to define the manufacturing process as ending at the time of loading for shipment.

 

Rgds / Charles.C