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#1 Tracey Scott

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Posted 11 October 2017 - 02:18 AM

Hi all,

 

We have a quality manual that is old but working ok very simple, I am updated it slowly . I have changed our document control procedure which has change our doc identification /template  and I have started with version 1 .

how do I add this to the old manual without causing a non conformance? Only the updated procedures follow the document control procedure. Can someone offer any advise.

 

thanks 

Tracey

 


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#2 Gerard H.

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 09:26 AM

Hi Tracey,

 

Your quality system is growing and evolving. That implicates, that the changes are coming with a quicker pace, which has its impact on your system

 

In your situation, I would create a project of indexation of your quality documents. You split it up by topic and you start with version-numbering all the documents. You just put the version number and date, creating a starting point with version 1. However, with this one by one approach, you can use the oppurtunity to revise the documents (a requirement of the certification schedules). That takes more time, but it prepares you for the upcoming audits.

 

There will probably come reactions and ideas from other members.

 

Good luck!

 

Kind regards,

 

Gerard Heerkens


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#3 Tracey Scott

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 08:38 PM

Thanks Gerald 

 

What would this look like.

A project Index that  with new procedure recorded and ID of previous procedure?

Would I still remove old procedures and replace with new?

 

Thanks again 

Tracey


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#4 nwilson

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 08:56 PM

Did you have a documented meeting to discuss the new changes with the Food Safety &/or Management Teams?  If you have documented the process and are in the works of moving to a new doc control format there should be no non-conformance for this.  So long as there is timeline to get all the remaining documents into the new format and that the process is being reviewed.   


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#5 Charles.C

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 09:28 PM

Hi all,

 

We have a quality manual that is old but working ok very simple, I am updated it slowly . I have changed our document control procedure which has change our doc identification /template  and I have started with version 1 .

how do I add this to the old manual without causing a non conformance? Only the updated procedures follow the document control procedure. Can someone offer any advise.

 

thanks 

Tracey

 

Hi Tracy,

 

In theory it's simple. You could simply generate a new, documented, procedure, to state what you are doing after date X/Y/Z.

But it's clearly not a very elegant solution for other users, plus the practicality may depend on the details of yr old/new systems.

 

I had a sort of related problem, dozens of old methods/forms identified by a footered alphanumeric/date system. i chose to "update" everything.

 

I copied/reduced all the old documents and then added new references in the free footer space generated. Can be done pretty easily via PC template/ printer/bulk xeroxing although rather labor intensive. But this would be less elegant if there was significant cross-referencing within/between text in old documents. My old documents were all standalone.


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Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


#6 Gerard H.

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 08:11 AM

Dear Tracey,

 

With a project I mean to define an objective and to take time to work toward it. For example 4 hours/week during 6 months.

 

There are several possible approaches or combinations to resolve your question. The suggested work method from Charles C. is a good one. That permits you to integrate your old documents and build a coherent documentary system at the same time.

 

It may be an idea to visit one or more companies in the neighbourhood to look at their document management system, giving you a better vision of how it can be.

 

Indexing is just meant as synonymous for "Table of contents".

 

I hope to have clarified some of your questions.

 

Kind regards,

 

Gerard


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#7 cbillingsley

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 04:24 PM

Hi Tracey,

 

I see there have been several answers to your question so far, but I thought I'd add one little insight from my experience with SQF document control.

 

While trying to get ready for SQF certification, there were hundreds of documents I had to revise. I started with a standard format that I picked up from a consultant - a header on each page that displayed the company logo, document name, document number, version number, issue date, supersedes date (this was used to show the issue date of the previous version; if it was the first version, we entered "New Document" in place of a date). It looked like this -

 Company

Logo

 

 

(site location, if applicable)

 

Document Name

Issued Date

 

Page

1 of #

Code

**-***-#.###

Supersedes Date

 

Version

#

The "Code" or document number is just a unique identifier, so it won't matter to an auditor. But just as an example, here's how ours are set up - above you'll see **-***-#.### In place of the first two asterisks, we have a two letter code for the site (our company has sites in different locations, so we simply took two letters of the town name and used those). Then there's a dash for separation, and in place of the next asterisks, we used letters to identify the department (ex. QA for Quality Assurance, SAN for Sanitation, etc.). Then we had a unique numbering scheme - 1 was for policies, 2 was for procedures, and 3 was for operational forms. So the site policy would be numbered as 1.###, a procedure would be 2.###, and an operational form would be 3.###. The ### is just sequencial numbers 001,002,003 and so on, so each document has a unique number.

 

After all documents were revised in this format, we created a register (we used an Excel spreadsheet, with each department having a separate sheet). In the register, we entered every document name, the doc #, issue date, etc. This register was helpful when a team member wanted to verify that they were following the most up-to-date procedure or using the most updated version of a form. Whenever a document is revised, however, the dates and version must be updated on both the document AND the register, otherwise you lose your control.

 

Anyway, I hope that this was helpful for you and that I didn't make it to difficult to follow. :uhm: Let me know if you have any questions.

 

Regards,

Chris


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#8 cbillingsley

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 04:54 PM

Sorry, I realized my example pic didn't show up like I thought it would. (And that's why I work in QA and not IT, lol) Here's an attachment instead.Attached File  Capture.PNG   8.24KB   0 downloads


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#9 GrainGirl

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 09:01 PM

cbillingsley,

Thanks for the clear explanation. Very helpful.

 

As a followup, I am curious about record keeping. GFSI schemes as well as FSMA require record keeping for a number of years, so I assume you do retain old versions. But do you retain everything (i.e., all types of documents - policies, procedures, forms)? Is there anything you have decided you do not need to keep as you create new versions?  And what is your system for archiving old versions so employees don't mistakenly find and use an old version? 

 

Thanks!


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#10 cbillingsley

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Posted 07 December 2017 - 02:59 PM

cbillingsley,

Thanks for the clear explanation. Very helpful.

 

As a followup, I am curious about record keeping. GFSI schemes as well as FSMA require record keeping for a number of years, so I assume you do retain old versions. But do you retain everything (i.e., all types of documents - policies, procedures, forms)? Is there anything you have decided you do not need to keep as you create new versions?  And what is your system for archiving old versions so employees don't mistakenly find and use an old version? 

 

Thanks!

Hi GrainGirl,

Here at my facility, we have to retain records for 5 years, so I understand your concern with that aspect of GFSI-benchmarked schemes. Here's my take on your question - your old versions of documents shouldn't be considered records. I'm sure if someone has a different view on this, they'll correct me. Your operational forms (say an inspection form, for instance) are not records, UNLESS they've been filled out. This goes for any form in use. Your policies and procedures, however, will ALWAYS be considered records. Rather than keep a copy of every previous version you've had, I would recommend a revision record. At the end of each policy or procedure you have written up, insert a three column table with a title of "Revision Record". Here, you can list the date a revision was made, the name of the employee that made the revision, and a brief description of the changes. Easy peasy. I haven't had an auditor so much as raise an eyebrow when reviewing this practice.

 

As for controlling documents.... it's definitely a team effort. If employees have been given free rein to make copies of their forms as they need them, you've got your work cut out for you. When we have a revision to a form, we communicate it to all effected department/shift managers. The issue date for the revised document can be listed as several days later - so if you have a facility that runs Mon-Fri, make your issue date the following Monday. This gives you a chance to collect the old versions from those operators who seem to hoard them in their lockers, drawers, or glovebox of their vehicle :eek_yello:. All forms should be printed originals. Limit access to files to as few personnel as possible (i.e. just shift managers). and then you can issue forms during your pre-shift meetings - just enough to make it through the shift. Have a zero tolerance policy on making copies of operational forms. I'm sure there may be other ways of controlling documents, but the above method has worked fairly well since we started following it. Just remember that habits aren't broken overnight, so stick with it. Eventually everyone will fall in line.

 

Regards,

Chris


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