12 replies to this topic

[angie0612]

hello, everyone!  i'm currently working in a tropical country, a coffee shop to be precise.  we have bakery products on sale aside from the coffee beverages.  we have a display chiller which i require the temperature to be at 5^oC all the time. the bakery products that we sell are: danishes with savory (curry chicken and tuna) and sweet fillings (pineapple preserve); egg tart; sugar donuts; banana cupcake, tiramisu, cheesecakes and sponge cakes with cream frostings.

 

the frequent ambient temperature in the store is between 23^oC and 28^oC. so for now, i require my staff to store all bakery products inside the display chiller just to be safe and warm the product in the microwave for 30 seconds before serving.

 

my concern is, what is the temperature danger zone of bakery products?  appreciate it very much for all your suggestions and info...

[NancyVnz]

Hi Angie,

 

I think storage temperature depends on the risk of food that might be contaminated when storing at ambient temperature. For a risk ranking guideline you can try FDA link:

https://www.fda.gov/...A/UCM380212.pdf

 

For high-risk food here we follow the 2hours/4hours rule. However, some bakery product could be degraded in texture if you keep them in the refrigerator, so common sense we need to balance between the two above factors.

 

I found an interesting article related to your question:

https://www.dedewils...ng-baked-goods/

 

Cheers,

 

Nancy

[GMO]

Simple answer is, it depends.  It's always going to be fillings which make a bakery product more risky rather than the baked food itself.  So pastry, bread isn't a hazard at room temperature.  Once you add something which can be a place bacteria can grow then the risk increases.  So meat fillings, definitely chill.  Egg fillings would chill as well.  When it comes to fillings which are higher in sugar and salt then it's possible they don't need chilling.  So, for example jam tarts where the jam is made from about 50% sugar won't be an issue for short term storage.

 

It may require a case by case analysis but certainly what you're doing seems sensible.

[Charles.C]

Hi angie,

 

As implied in previous post, shelf life is an important related aspect to what is (legally?) FS possible. Preservatives are also nowadays capable of achieving surprising longevities.

 

From memory the UK has some special provisions in their Hygiene Regulations for allowing certain baked products to be stored at ambient temperatures for 1 day. This was highlighted a few years back regarding the retail appearance of some so-called "ambient hotdogs". Rapidly removed after hitting the headlines.

 

A generic micro. answer to yr danger zone query is sort of RTE food 101 but, as per GMO, the risk really needs assessing case-by-case.

 

PS - I understand yr logic but microwave warming for 30sec is a questionable "safety" measure IMO.

[FurFarmandFork]

 

 

I understand yr logic but microwave warming for 30sec is a questionable "safety" measure IMO.

 

I think they meant that they kept all the food chilled for safety, the microwave is solely to warm it up to the customers preference rather than intended as a lethality treatment.

[Charles.C]

I think they meant that they kept all the food chilled for safety, the microwave is solely to warm it up to the customers preference rather than intended as a lethality treatment.

 

Hi 3F,

Thks, you're right. I would have included, albeit grammatically unacceptable, a  comma.

 

TBH, whenever i have warmed up chilled baked goods (eg pineapple filled pies) in a microwave for 30 secs, it has always destroyed the pastry texture ( >> soggy). I always use an oven but takes a lot longer of course. Maybe it relates to the pastry formula.
 

 

my concern is, what is the temperature danger zone of bakery products?  appreciate it very much for all your suggestions and info...

 

 

Answers are legion, often linked to discussions on maximum food cooling/holding times.

 

One "simple" response -

For the consumer it is very difficult to understand the complex inter-relationship of the
nature of the food and temperature to determine a safe cooling time. Therefore, generalised
recommendations have been made. Often the temperature range of 63°C to 5°C is considered
to be the ‘danger zone’ in which bacteria have the greatest chance of growing but as can be
seen from Table 1 this could be narrowed down still further to 55°C to 5°C. Furthermore, it
has been recommended that food should not remain in this ‘danger zone’ for longer than 2
hours. However, this is a very conservative time period since we are taking the extremes of
the growth ranges for harmful bacteria into account in combination with the fact that other
conditions for bacterial growth in the food are rarely optimal. Considering these facts a true
‘danger zone’ with a restriction of 2 hours has been suggested as lying between 55°C and
15°C [5].

 

 Temperature Guidance for Cooking, Cooling, and Storage of Food.pdf   213.92KB   70 downloads

 

Another, more detailed, but much more complex answer -

 

https://www.foodsafe...ne-reevaluated/

[angie0612]

Yes -- that's what I meant...microwaving the product is for warming purposes only. and I also agree, using the microwave to warm the product just makes the pastry soggy...but the fastest way to serve the customer...

I think they meant that they kept all the food chilled for safety, the microwave is solely to warm it up to the customers preference rather than intended as a lethality treatment.

[angie0612]

thank you to all those who replied -- I appreciate your taking the time to give me pointers and articles to read.  

[GMO]

Charles is absolutely right on the strange anomalies in the UK, I believe sausage rolls are one of them (cooked sausage meat in pastry) but having said that I've not seen any major retailers doing that for a while now so perhaps they even recognise it is a risk.

[enforcer123]

 

Charles is absolutely right on the strange anomalies in the UK, I believe sausage rolls are one of them (cooked sausage meat in pastry) but having said that I've not seen any major retailers doing that for a while now so perhaps they even recognise it is a risk.

 

I am sure I have seen lots of baked meat pies etc stored at ambient in the UK. Sausages rolls, cornish pasties etc. 

 

The 2013 Temp Control Guidance gives the following exemption, but what is a short period defined as? I am struggling to understand whether such products can be stored for 4 hours at ambient or whole day of production or 24 hours?

 

 

"Other foods are normally sold to consumers with a short shelf life, as the quality of the product is not acceptable at a later stage. This would include certain bakery products and sandwiches (although not those containing cooked products described in paragraph 9b), which are sold within a short period of being produced or prepared. Bakery products would include, for example; uncut baked egg and milk pastry products, e.g. custard tarts; or cooked pies and pasties that are completely encased in pastry to which nothing has been added after baking"

 

Any clarity?

[enforcer123]

Edit: I can see reference to the strange anomaly in 1995 temp control regs but have these not now been revoked? 

 

"Exemptions from temperature control are considered acceptable for certain bakery products. These are:- (a) Uncut baked egg and milk pastry products, eg custard tarts and Yorkshire curd tarts intended for sale within 24 hours of production. (b) Cooked pies and pasties containing meat, fish or any substitute for meat or fish or vegetables or any combination of these encased in pastry to which nothing has been added after baking and sausage rolls, which are intended to be sold on the day of production or the next day" 

 

 

GMO/Charles - your clarification would be greatly appreciated!

[GMO]

Edit: I can see reference to the strange anomaly in 1995 temp control regs but have these not now been revoked? 

 

"Exemptions from temperature control are considered acceptable for certain bakery products. These are:- (a) Uncut baked egg and milk pastry products, eg custard tarts and Yorkshire curd tarts intended for sale within 24 hours of production. (b) Cooked pies and pasties containing meat, fish or any substitute for meat or fish or vegetables or any combination of these encased in pastry to which nothing has been added after baking and sausage rolls, which are intended to be sold on the day of production or the next day" 

 

 

GMO/Charles - your clarification would be greatly appreciated!

 

I have to admit I don't know!  I remember contacting a retailer some years back to say "look, why are sausage rolls at room temperature?"  but as I intimated above, I've not seen that for some years and in practice, custard tarts are always in the chiller nowadays too.  The way the retailer in question used to handle it was to put a same day use by date on the sausage rolls.  Was it still a risk?  Yes so either the law has changed or the retailers have decided not to take the risk, it would be interesting to know without wading through pages of EU and UK legislation!

Any sausage roll experts?

[Charles.C]

Edit: I can see reference to the strange anomaly in 1995 temp control regs but have these not now been revoked? 

 

"Exemptions from temperature control are considered acceptable for certain bakery products. These are:- (a) Uncut baked egg and milk pastry products, eg custard tarts and Yorkshire curd tarts intended for sale within 24 hours of production. (b) Cooked pies and pasties containing meat, fish or any substitute for meat or fish or vegetables or any combination of these encased in pastry to which nothing has been added after baking and sausage rolls, which are intended to be sold on the day of production or the next day" 

 

 

GMO/Charles - your clarification would be greatly appreciated!

 

(slightly OT)

 

Hi enforcer,

 

I suspect yr quotations are probably still valid.

 

i suggest you have a look at the below (directly/indirectly) related threads from 2010/2015 respectively.  which are perhaps as equally relevant now as then. (

(plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose –  the more things change, the more they stay the same ?)

 

http://www.ifsqn.com...-sausage-rolls/

 

http://www.ifsqn.com...bient-products/

 

(many of the URL links are long-gone but i think the quotations are mostly self-explanatory)

 

Somewhere archived there must be some fascinating validatory data.

 

JFI here is the only current link I could find to the hotdog incident -

 

https://www.express....t-sausage-rolls

(comments seem to hv also been "archived")

 

(noticed the Daily Express has morphed into Express and gone tabloid. But Crusader has no chains !)