Jump to content

  • Quick Navigation
Photo
- - - - -

Blow Moulding


  • You cannot start a new topic
  • Please log in to reply
12 replies to this topic

#1 Charles Chew

Charles Chew

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 1,178 posts
  • 48 thanks
5
Neutral

  • Malaysia
    Malaysia
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Malaysia
  • Interests:Food, food and food!

Posted 28 April 2004 - 11:35 AM

Implementing a HACCP Program for a PET (Polyethylene Terepthalate) bottle manufacturer where the packaging will end up as a food contact material.

Is there anyone out there who has done the chemical analysis before for such a program? It would help bigtime.

Regards

Charles Chew


  • 0
Cheers,
Charles Chew
www.naturalmajor.com

#2 Simon

Simon

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Admin
  • 11,390 posts
  • 1018 thanks
222
Excellent

  • United Kingdom
    United Kingdom
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester
  • Interests:Life, Family, Running, Cycling, Manager of a Football Team, Work, Watching Sport, The Internet, Food, Real Ale and Sleeping...

Posted 29 April 2004 - 01:45 PM

Can anybody help Charles out?

Regards,
Simon


  • 0

Best Regards,

Simon Timperley
IFSQN Administrator
 
hand-pointing-down.gif

Need food safety advice?
Relax, you've come to the right place…

The IFSQN is a helpful network of volunteers providing answers and support. Check out the forums and get free advice from the experts on food safety management systems and a wide range of food safety topics.

 
We could make a huge list of rules, terms and conditions, but you probably wouldn’t read them.

All that we ask is that you observe the following:


1. No spam, profanity, pornography, trolling or personal attacks

2. Topics and posts should be “on topic” and related to site content
3. No (unpaid) advertising
4. You may have one account on the board at any one time
5. Enjoy your stay!


#3 Puzzle

Puzzle

    Grade - SIFSQN

  • IFSQN Senior
  • 254 posts
  • 0 thanks
0
Neutral
  • Interests:Petrolhead, sleeping, too much food and many other items that are forgotten!!

Posted 29 April 2004 - 03:54 PM

Simon/Charles

Sorry not able to help.

We are injection moulding and oddly enough we do not process PET, yet.

Chris


  • 0

#4 Charles Chew

Charles Chew

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 1,178 posts
  • 48 thanks
5
Neutral

  • Malaysia
    Malaysia
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Malaysia
  • Interests:Food, food and food!

Posted 29 April 2004 - 04:46 PM

Hi Chris,

Thanks for trying. I have found out some of the answers and for those who are interested, the potential hazards are:
1. Acetaldehyde (think thats how its spelt) gas emission from the resin.
2. Oil from air compressor during blowing process
3. Dirt and dust from pipes during the compressed air stage

Thats about all I got. Wonder what else
:crybaby:

Charles Chew


  • 1
Cheers,
Charles Chew
www.naturalmajor.com

#5 Charles Chew

Charles Chew

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 1,178 posts
  • 48 thanks
5
Neutral

  • Malaysia
    Malaysia
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Malaysia
  • Interests:Food, food and food!

Posted 29 April 2004 - 05:01 PM

A matter of interest. Most suppliers today provide Certificate of Analysis (COA) on the raw ingredients being (food additives) they sell.

Does it make sense for plastic packaging manufacturers to do the same as a matter of assurance that the materials used are food grade or finished bottles are free from specific toxic by-products perhaps arising from the resins or whatever it may be.

For example, providing a COA would certainly help to provide assurance that bottle rinsing is not required prior to say cold filling (hot fill is not a problem)

Charles Chew


  • 0
Cheers,
Charles Chew
www.naturalmajor.com

#6 Simon

Simon

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Admin
  • 11,390 posts
  • 1018 thanks
222
Excellent

  • United Kingdom
    United Kingdom
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester
  • Interests:Life, Family, Running, Cycling, Manager of a Football Team, Work, Watching Sport, The Internet, Food, Real Ale and Sleeping...

Posted 29 April 2004 - 07:58 PM

Hi Charles,

In the UK the main piece of legislation that applies to PET intended for direct food contact is The Plastic Materials and Articles in Contact with Food Regulations 1998. There is some basic information on the page below:

Food Standards Agency - Plastics

Regards,
Simon


  • 0

Best Regards,

Simon Timperley
IFSQN Administrator
 
hand-pointing-down.gif

Need food safety advice?
Relax, you've come to the right place…

The IFSQN is a helpful network of volunteers providing answers and support. Check out the forums and get free advice from the experts on food safety management systems and a wide range of food safety topics.

 
We could make a huge list of rules, terms and conditions, but you probably wouldn’t read them.

All that we ask is that you observe the following:


1. No spam, profanity, pornography, trolling or personal attacks

2. Topics and posts should be “on topic” and related to site content
3. No (unpaid) advertising
4. You may have one account on the board at any one time
5. Enjoy your stay!


#7 Simon

Simon

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Admin
  • 11,390 posts
  • 1018 thanks
222
Excellent

  • United Kingdom
    United Kingdom
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester
  • Interests:Life, Family, Running, Cycling, Manager of a Football Team, Work, Watching Sport, The Internet, Food, Real Ale and Sleeping...

Posted 29 April 2004 - 08:27 PM

A matter of interest. Most suppliers today provide Certificate of Analysis (COA) on the raw ingredients being (food additives) they sell.  Does it make sense for plastic packaging manufacturers to do the same as a matter of assurance that the materials used are food grade or finished bottles are free from specific toxic by-products perhaps arising from the resins or whatever it may be.

What would you do with the COA Charles? Verify the details against the agreed specification to ensure that all elements are within tolerance or file it?

You are buying an agreed specification from an approved supplier who operates a positive release system. They have verified everything and the product is quality assured else they would not have sent it to you.

If you must have a certificate, ask your supplier to provide an annual Certificate of Conformity. Maybe once a quarter you could fax your supplier a Purchase Order number and ask them to send you all the related batch records within 1 hour. I'd verify this to demonstrate due diligence.

Regards,
Simon
  • 0

Best Regards,

Simon Timperley
IFSQN Administrator
 
hand-pointing-down.gif

Need food safety advice?
Relax, you've come to the right place…

The IFSQN is a helpful network of volunteers providing answers and support. Check out the forums and get free advice from the experts on food safety management systems and a wide range of food safety topics.

 
We could make a huge list of rules, terms and conditions, but you probably wouldn’t read them.

All that we ask is that you observe the following:


1. No spam, profanity, pornography, trolling or personal attacks

2. Topics and posts should be “on topic” and related to site content
3. No (unpaid) advertising
4. You may have one account on the board at any one time
5. Enjoy your stay!


#8 Puzzle

Puzzle

    Grade - SIFSQN

  • IFSQN Senior
  • 254 posts
  • 0 thanks
0
Neutral
  • Interests:Petrolhead, sleeping, too much food and many other items that are forgotten!!

Posted 29 April 2004 - 09:24 PM

We do supply 'Pump' components that MAY be used in food delivery systems, but are primarily for cosmetics use.

These are produced from commodity materials (HDPE, PP, LDPE) and all are manufactured with 'food grade' materials.

Delivery CofC etc is used but never COA.

However we do have the material specification on file and regularly verify that the 'food grade' certification is valid. These materials are specified by the customer.

If you study the Greenpeace hoo har about PVC. The information spouted by them would suggest it is highly toxic, however only when being cracked and formulated are the dioxins produced ( and controlled etc). These are not released in normal manufacture. Please note 'normal manufacture'.

And please never attempt to mix (and process) acetal and PVC.


  • 0

#9 Charles Chew

Charles Chew

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 1,178 posts
  • 48 thanks
5
Neutral

  • Malaysia
    Malaysia
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Malaysia
  • Interests:Food, food and food!

Posted 30 April 2004 - 08:31 AM

Hi Simon,

The Food Standard Agency - Plastic has given me some pointers on where to look for further details. Hoping to find out if Codex has any standard on this.

Thanks

Charles Chew


  • 0
Cheers,
Charles Chew
www.naturalmajor.com

#10 Charles Chew

Charles Chew

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 1,178 posts
  • 48 thanks
5
Neutral

  • Malaysia
    Malaysia
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Malaysia
  • Interests:Food, food and food!

Posted 30 April 2004 - 08:43 AM

Simon,

The COA is just to confirm that you have a benchmark to measure your in-coming raw materials from your suppliers as a form of a control mechanism. Food Auditors ask for it.

If you had done a factory inspection on your suppliers, an annual renewal of COA will suffice to confirm the status of a positive release system.

But if you had not and these suppliers do not embrace any other standards (eg. ISO 9001:2000) or maintain a minimum internal control system, you may want to consider batch COAs. Its really up to you on how you wish to have assurance control on your ingredients.

HACCP Programs running into their 2nd or 3rd year may also wish to consider a scorecard system for their approved suppliers.....

Cheers
Charles Chew


  • 0
Cheers,
Charles Chew
www.naturalmajor.com

#11 Charles Chew

Charles Chew

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 1,178 posts
  • 48 thanks
5
Neutral

  • Malaysia
    Malaysia
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Malaysia
  • Interests:Food, food and food!

Posted 30 April 2004 - 09:13 AM

Hi Chris,

PET materials may be food grades BUT after it has been blown, it tends to release "acetaldehyde gas" which requires to be "breath off" over a minimum safe period of 24 hours. If you ever find bottled water tasting some what "sweet" and "aromatic", that is dissolved acetaldehyde and is a known carcinogenic BUT same time, it is widely considered "FOOD GRADE".

Thats about all I know on PET but I find the food grade status some what misleading.

What is CofC? I was just trying to find out more about common practices in the plastic industry. Perhaps, COA is not quite applicable and it does not look so.

Reason why I am keen to know more of the chemical and toxicity hazards is basically to complete my hazard analysis on the PET pre-forms BUT I know the real hazards are in the process NOT the ingredients.............BUT it is part of the Decision Tree requirements.

Regards

Charles Chew


  • 0
Cheers,
Charles Chew
www.naturalmajor.com

#12 Simon

Simon

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Admin
  • 11,390 posts
  • 1018 thanks
222
Excellent

  • United Kingdom
    United Kingdom
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester
  • Interests:Life, Family, Running, Cycling, Manager of a Football Team, Work, Watching Sport, The Internet, Food, Real Ale and Sleeping...

Posted 03 May 2004 - 08:22 PM

What is CofC?

It's "Certificate of Conformance" Charles.

Regards,
Simon
  • 0

Best Regards,

Simon Timperley
IFSQN Administrator
 
hand-pointing-down.gif

Need food safety advice?
Relax, you've come to the right place…

The IFSQN is a helpful network of volunteers providing answers and support. Check out the forums and get free advice from the experts on food safety management systems and a wide range of food safety topics.

 
We could make a huge list of rules, terms and conditions, but you probably wouldn’t read them.

All that we ask is that you observe the following:


1. No spam, profanity, pornography, trolling or personal attacks

2. Topics and posts should be “on topic” and related to site content
3. No (unpaid) advertising
4. You may have one account on the board at any one time
5. Enjoy your stay!


#13 Charles Chew

Charles Chew

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 1,178 posts
  • 48 thanks
5
Neutral

  • Malaysia
    Malaysia
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Malaysia
  • Interests:Food, food and food!

Posted 04 May 2004 - 07:50 AM

Got it Simon. Just that we don't short- term it here this way although it s the same....but Cert. of Compliance.

Charles Chew


  • 0
Cheers,
Charles Chew
www.naturalmajor.com




1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users