11 replies to this topic

[mcureton]

I am just wondering if there is a timeframe in which an existing manager/supervisor has to update a form or procedure since the previous manager has been gone for 2 years. I have not needed to update the existing document because it has everything that I would put on it. I can't do a revision unless I add something so I don't know if there is a time limit for this.

[SQFconsultant]

Well, you have to keep a record of amendments and additions to documents. 

 

Any documents with the former persons name would be considered outdated and should have been amended with a note on a record as to why the document was amended.

 

And your rule about how you can not do a revision unless you add something - came from where?

 

I would have been revising and amending the day after the person left.

 

In the future you might want to use position titles instead of names on documents,, it can cut down on a lot of editing.

[TimG]

"In the future you might want to use position titles instead of names on documents,, it can cut down on a lot of editing."

 

I've seen that once on a document approval, I believe it said "Quality Manager" in the 'approved/verified by' section of the revision history. Is that sufficient for SQF?

 

To piggy back on mcureton's question, what about company statements? Surely anything signed by a former employee needs to be recreated (verified, etc.) by the person taking their position?

[Setanta]

 

"In the future you might want to use position titles instead of names on documents,, it can cut down on a lot of editing."

 

I've seen that once on a document approval, I believe it said "Quality Manager" in the 'approved/verified by' section of the revision history. Is that sufficient for SQF?

 

To piggy back on mcureton's question, what about company statements? Surely anything signed by a former employee needs to be recreated (verified, etc.) by the person taking their position?

 

 

 

Something as important as a Company Management Policy, I would expect to be changed as soon as that position was refilled. For Org Charts, I do when there is a change for lead positions and annually for the rest.

[TimG]

I'm more in the weeds on this one than something as big as the management policy or org chart. I'm thinking your standard ole policy/procedures and statements (such as allergen, we follow FSMA, etc) created to supply customers.

That's a LOT of stuff, and I don't update each annually (review doesn't always = update).

 I like to take positions where I need fix systems, get them running smooth, and find another place that needs fixing; I move around every few years (I should probably stick with one place here soon, getting too old for that). Should I be going in and updating each document by removing the name of the previous person who's authorized revisions if the document doesn't need any other changes? That doesn't really make sense to me.

[Ryan M.]

There is no time limit depending on where the person's name is on the document.  If it is in relation to a certain responsibility for the procedure, program, or policy then it needs to be revised.  However, if the person's name is on there as an editor or creator of the document and if it has not been revised then no need to update the person's name.

 

Going forward I would modify to "SQF Practitioner".

Edited by Ryan M., 12 May 2021 - 02:32 PM.

[mcureton]

I have been keeping a master folder of all Quality procedures and quality forms and notating any document changes or revisions. I just assumed that you don't revise unless you have something to add as to why you made a revision or amendment, but I guess if you are changing the name it constitutes a change and also assures auditors that you have thoroughly reviewed the document and placed your name as the presiding author of the document after the previous manager.

[mcureton]

That is a good way to go about it. As another gentleman responded mentioning that using manager, supervisor, or PCQI, and as you stated SQF Practitioner would probably be a better way to word documents to avoid updating name changes.

[BritAbroad]

As a GFSI Auditor, Technical Manager and previous production manager i see this from all sides.  

 

You never actually "need" to amend the documents, your archived documents (Org Chart) will show who this person was and the position they held but make sure that you have amended the Org Chart, emergency contact info etc. 

As previously stated, stick to job titles however, make sure that the person authorizing the change has authority to do so, providing your Org Chart is upto date with titles and names then the rest of the HACCP plan QMS should refer to titles only. 

Thanks

Paul

[Fishlady]

Our procedures have a header that includes the name of the person who created the document, the person who most recently modified it, and the person who approved it.  We also have a chart that shows each time it was reviewed or revised (not all reviews end up with revisions) and who did the review and/or revision.  Thus, the document may have many names on it, but it contains the full history of each person who contributed to what it looks like today.  I rather like having the full history available at a glance.

[johnmcip]

Well, you have to keep a record of amendments and additions to documents. 

 

Any documents with the former persons name would be considered outdated and should have been amended with a note on a record as to why the document was amended.

 

And your rule about how you can not do a revision unless you add something - came from where?

 

I would have been revising and amending the day after the person left.

 

In the future you might want to use position titles instead of names on documents,, it can cut down on a lot of editing.

 

Well hold on here...The previous managers name is next to the "created by" field. Did the previous manager not create that document? If someone asked "who created this document" what would you say?

I put the name of the person that issued the current version. Would you recommend I take that name off as well? 

[SQFconsultant]

Well hold on here...The previous managers name is next to the "created by" field. Did the previous manager not create that document? If someone asked "who created this document" what would you say?

I put the name of the person that issued the current version. Would you recommend I take that name off as well? 

.......

A. I've actually never asked who created a document and this information doesnt even show on a document for us nor our clients wuth exception of 2 that show created by and the title name. I do not recomnend that names are put on any documents unless it is sonething like an authorization list. Etc.