9 replies to this topic

[Nashon TK]

Hi,

I am glad to find such an exciting members forum. I work for a tea company based in Kenya and would like to hear from members who have implimented ISO 22k in leaf tea manufacturing firms. my specific query is whether metals (a big problem in tea manufacturing) should be treated as CCPs or O-PRP.

Edited by Nashon TK, 01 June 2007 - 11:23 AM.

[OZLEM ACIR]

Hi,whether metals (a big problem in tea manufacturing) should be treated as CCPs or O-PRPis a good question I think.According to me, it is CCP in HACCP. Because, if you dont prevent metal residue in special process step (CCP),there will be no feasible chance to research and find metal in other process point. In addition, risk analysis in ISO 22000 says that severity for metal ( I think high) x occurrance probability for metal ( I think medium ) x determination probability ( if there is a machine, number is low) ratio gives risk value. Whether risk value is higher than determined number (changes according to process type) or not, it becomes CCP pr CP.But, O-PRP's are the necessities of basic principles of food factory such as factory foundation,air quality, water quality etc.See you OZLEM

[Suzuki]

Hi,

Yes, I know tea is terribly contaminated with metal filings. But what if the tea leafs are packed inside teabags, would it make any difference if there are metals in there after flour mills do fortify their flours with iron filings. Also if the tea bag is "stapled" with the thread on - that could be another issue to deal with i.e. metal detection is impossible.

Furthermore, if tea is brewed w/o tea bag, you only drink the tea and discard the leafs. So where is the problem.

Maybe its just OPRP but can also be CCP if you feel the severity and risk is there or are the PRPs adequately in place.

Regards
Suzuki

[Madam A. D-tor]

Hello,

First, let me say, that I don't have any professional knowledge of tea processing. I only know it as a frequent user.

In my opinion metall can only be a CCP, when you have measurements to reduce the risk. For example magnets, metal detection or foreign body detection. It is like OZLEM explained not an O-PRP, because PRP are the basic things. Often also referred al Good Manufactury Programs. (indeed: water, pestcontrol, maintenance, hand washing policies, etc.)

It also depends what your customers do with your product. Tea is not only used for infusion, but also for cosmetics and as an ingredient for foods. E.g. in my country a biscuit producer will introduce biscuits with real tea this autumn. Metal (and other foreign bodies) will be an item then.

On the other hand, although I only use the infusion for drinking, I don't like the idea that I drink an infusion of metals. That is my opinion as a consumer.

Greetings, Madam A. D-tor

[Simon]

Hi,

I am glad to find such an exciting members forum. I work for a tea company based in Kenya and would like to hear from members who have implimented ISO 22k in leaf tea manufacturing firms. my specific query is whether metals (a big problem in tea manufacturing) should be treated as CCPs or O-PRP.

Have the members answered your query satisfactorily Nashon TK? It would be nice if you could let us know.

Regards,
Simon

[Charles.C]

Dear All,

I believe this thread illustrates yet again how successfully ISO 22k has created some nice extra work for risk analysts on top of that which already existed within the traditional HACCP area.

I know very little about tea but I noted the original poster stated “metals”. Is this necessarily referring to iron ? Could be lead or other heavy metal contamination?. If iron, he is presumably referring to a “physical” safety hazard since Fe is not normally considered to present a significant chemical health risk, I think. This category of hazard is normally not a CCP in HACCP as such.

If we are limited to specifying the HACCP status of a metal detector, the awarding of this step as a CCP is sort of mandated in the ‘tree’ type analysis scheme regardless of the actual scenario and most auditors (all?) will be unhappy if it is not seen as such IMEX. After many conceptual arguments with auditors over the years I gave in and automatically classify it CCP even though you can document opposite opinions.
I suppose once it becomes automatic within a manufacturing safety scheme, you can consider re-classifying it as a Pre-requisite although this is surely not the original HACCP logic ? (but possibly is the ISO22k thinking).

From a pure risk analysis aspect, If one wishes to consider the basic allocation of risk status to “physical” iron one immediate standard query for the risk assessor is – Are there any documented statistics of iron particles in tea having caused significant health consequences ?, eg lost teeth, - I sincerely hope not for my own personal future safety.

From a chemical point of view I always thought a little bit of iron in the diet was supposed to be good / necessary for you ??

Alternatively, coffee is also recommended due to its removing heavy metals from the water system –
http://www.csiro.au/...2000/coffee.htm

Rgds / Charles.C

[Carolyna]

Hi,

I am glad to find such an exciting members forum. I work for a tea company based in Kenya and would like to hear from members who have implimented ISO 22k in leaf tea manufacturing firms. my specific query is whether metals (a big problem in tea manufacturing) should be treated as CCPs or O-PRP.

Its indeed a very resourceful forum.Am also working in the tea industry in Kenya.Where do you work Nashon?We are currently pursuing HACCP certification.Metal is a hazard in tea and magnets is a CCP.However,how do I know/set the critical limits?Does teh FDA have something on this?

[Charles.C]

Hi Carolyna and welcome to the forum

In fact I think nearly every "FDA" seems to hv HACCP opinions on this subject although not specifically with respect to i22k

For example can see these recent items, which relate to USA and Canada.

http://www.ifsqn.com...f...=&pid=23948

http://www.ifsqn.com...f...=&pid=23899

(just happen to be my posts but there are many more here, very popular topic)

Rgds / Charles.C

[Erasmo]

Its indeed a very resourceful forum.Am also working in the tea industry in Kenya.Where do you work Nashon?We are currently pursuing HACCP certification.Metal is a hazard in tea and magnets is a CCP.However,how do I know/set the critical limits?Does teh FDA have something on this?

Hi Calorina. Pls read clauses 7.5 & 7.6.1 - If you select the magnet as a opPRP you don't have to set the critical limits. - Please be careful, do not confuse "critical limits" (7.6.3) with "acceptable level of tha hazard" (7.4.2).
Saludos!

[wamamili]

pins in the tea bags and metals finings should be differentiated in the hazard analysis work . have never worked in the tea factory but i hope where tea bags are being made, if not a different line then should be a different room . metal detectors should come before packing tea not sure.....based on risk assessment finings and pins may not fall in the same category . That is why we may require ccp to control finings and OPRPs to control pins .