Auditor wants a mock recall performed forwards and backwards

Ok, we recently had an audit and the auditor wants a mock recall performed both forwards and backwards. I dont really understand what he means by this. Does he want a mock recall and tracibility all performed in one or what? Im really confussed on this one.

Ok, we recently had an audit and the auditor wants a mock recall performed both forwards and backwards. I dont really understand what he means by this. Does he want a mock recall and tracibility all performed in one or what? Im really confussed on this one.

Dear dustishere,

Based on yr OP, you probably also need to do a search for "traceability". :smile:  (although some hits [there are many] will cover MR/TR).

a mock recall performed both forwards and backwards

More likely "a mock recall" should be replaced by  "traceability" but could also be a case of interpretation.

You omitted to mention which standard is involved. This is important since interpretations vary and may overlap.

Additionally, as indicated in post #2 of previous posted link, a third factor can be involved  - mass balance.

For example BRC6 standard separates mock recall / traceability, ie not as per post #2  in previous link but more like the interpretation of mock recall as in posts #3+ (but excluding post #6!). BRC also details many of the specific requirements thereby avoiding some confusion.

Rgds / Charles.C

Dear Dustishere,

                          Forward traceability - Tracing a product from your dispatch to where it went. ie., where you delivered your final product of a particular batch.  Backward Traceability - Tracing a final product back to the ingredients used for making it with all the details of ingredients. If you have an enterprise resource planning software, it is easy to do.  

Thanks for the replies. Im not sure what format the auditor is using as we are not looking to be certified (BRC, FSSC22000).

Would this form qulify or is it to simply of a form. Thanks again

Forward traceability ( Recall) is following the product from point of production of finished goods to warehouse and customers whereas backward traceability is tracing the ingredients and packaging which are gone in making the finished goods to the receival and supplier.

Thanks for the replies. Im not sure what format the auditor is using as we are not looking to be certified (BRC, FSSC22000).

 

Would this form qulify or is it to simply of a form. Thanks again

Dear dustishere,

Possibly but only yr "auditor" knows for sure. :smile:

Rgds / Charles,C

If the Company do not want to get certified in any standard, why auditor came? May be it was inspection

ProductRecallForm.doc   93.5KB   227 downloads

Thanks for the replies. Im not sure what format the auditor is using as we are not looking to be certified (BRC, FSSC22000).

 

Would this form qulify or is it to simply of a form. Thanks again

Hi Dear

Me I am FSSC 22000 accredited this is the good form that you have. And I like for mock recall exercise. You can have a look on attached Product Recall Form I am using and take what u need.

Regards

Ruhama

Dear Ruhama,

Yr form appears to be invisible. :smile:

Rgds / Charles.C

i think mock recall forwards and backwards should be from ingredients to the final product in forward mock recall and the backwards is tracing the product from the market and this should be useful when doing an investigation in an even that something goes wrong on the market and the source needs to be investigated to avoid recurrence.

Dear Sthembiso,

tracing

Perhaps this is why many people call it traceability ? :smile:

"backward recall" ?   Bit like "return to sender" ? :smile:

Semantics going crazy. Perhaps it is preferable to consider each request on a  case-by-case  basis.

Rgds / Charles.C

Per. SQF Code, Edition 7.1, this is traceability; tracks one up and one back.

2.6.2

Product Trace

i. Finished product is traceable to the customer (one up). Product(s) are identified and documented throughout the entire process from raw material receipt to shipping. All bulk raw materials are received into designated and identified tanks.  Also all food contact packaging and materials and other inputs (one back).

This is practical for an ingredient into a batch (one up), for chocolate powder; lot, bal on hand, COA (one back) 

Many people get confused between a traceability activity and a mock recall so it is very important to be clear on the terminology.  For the majority of GFSI standards the auditor is required to have the company perform a traceability activity during the audit process. This is to test that the food business can trace product forward going to the customer) and trace backwards (to the raw materials). It is also called a one up and one down traceability activity. It is about looking at all stages of production for product identification and trace (inclusive of rework and work in progress).

When I audit this clause for both BRC and SQF (and WQA in Australia) the business is required to support their traceability with all relevant paperwork (so this means it is not a one page report from the business perspective). We also look at "mass balance" which deals with the actual quantities of ingoing and outgoing. I am yet to see a traceability undertaken during the audit that is about to trace and quantify correctly (with suitable evidence).

Thanks HACCP Mentor

Yes traceability from  BRC & SQF standards means - tracing from finish product to raw material (backward) and fro raw material to finish product (forward) traceability which includes mass balance also.  Where as Mock recall is exercise where you attempt to get back the product which we identify are meeting food safety requirement or may be not fit for human consumption from distribution channel before goes to consumer.......

B T Gorti

Dear All,

The fact is that if the numerous previous threads on this subject are examined, almost all interpretive permutations of mock recall / mass balance / traceability are in use somewhere. It simply depends on the standard. Sadly In the present thread the standard is apparently indefinite so the net result is guesswork only although Post14 is probably the most often encountered general interpretation within GFSI (possibly GFSI even specifies its requirements ? :dunno: ).

Rgds / Charles.C

Does this mean that a mock recall is upto getting the product from the customer to the point of manufacture.

Tracebelity is the then the raws and processes used to make this product

For my mock product recall, I think up a scenario, and document all of the steps that I took, timings, people involved, from informing customers & authorities. I usually tell my customer that I'm carrying out a mock recall, and most are more than happy to play along with us.

As part of the Mock Recall, I also carry out a traceability exercise, to demonstrate that I can account all of the (affected)  ingredients and finished products

I do this at least twice a year. Even if your not looking for accreditation, it's good to try out your procedure.

Caz

yes i intend to do it like wise , but seperate it at the point of recall and tracebelity. My recall would stop till the FG reaches my factory and tracebility would begin from the start of process to manufacture this recalled FG to despatch. 

That would complete a cycle and I hope woud mmet the startd recall procedure

which industries really need to do the mock recall .

I do the same as Caz, but only once per year as my clients find it stressful  :sleazy:  

I get a sales widget to issue a fictitious complaint and then watch the heads start to spin :silly:

Endless hours of fun........

I do the same as Caz, but only once per year as my clients find it stressful  :sleazy:  

 

 

I get a sales widget to issue a fictitious complaint and then watch the heads start to spin :silly:

 

Endless hours of fun........

I try to do them more frequently, usually quarterly but don't get the customer involved for all of them.  Having been through several recalls, they can feel very different than a mock.  Key people may not be there when it happens and everyone on the team needs to know what to do and where to find the information.  Training only once a year usually means it can be a struggle especially when you take one or more key people out.  I want it to be more routine.

I was thinking of traceability when first reading. Mock recalls are a great way to verify your traceability.

I was being facetious......