BRC Rules regarding Creating documents and approving them and auditing

Hi All,

I was wondering what everyone's thoughts are on creating documents and approving them. Can the same person that created the document theoretically approve their document? Also, as the food safety manager, I would prefer auditing my program, because I am much harder on it than others are, so I would like to take my name off the created by and put my plants managers name on this? Any controversy with this? I know you should have your whole staff involved, but for us, its easier to have one or two main people auditing the plant as opposed to a big group of people... Let me know your thoughts.

Thanks,

Bre

Hi All,

 

 

I was wondering what everyone's thoughts are on creating documents and approving them.

 

Can the same person that created the document theoretically approve their document?

IMO It depends on the document and the relation to the issuer/user. From memory not mentioned in BRC ? Specific example ?

 

Also, as the food safety manager, I would prefer auditing my program, because I am much harder on it than others are, so I would like to take my name off the created by and put my plants managers name on this? Any controversy with this?

Again IMO it perhaps depends on the document but why not have the Plant Manager finalize/issue it if it relates directly to his/her function. ? Specific example ?

 

I know you should have your whole staff involved, but for us, its easier to have one or two main people auditing the plant as opposed to a big group of people... Let me know your thoughts.

The limitations / options are discussed in detail in several recent threads. Try searching a little?. BRC requires "independence" from memory.

added later - here are a couple, sort of mixed standards discussions, but basic idea is pretty uniform I think -

 

http://www.ifsqn.com/forum/index.php/topic/21702-internal-audit-help/#entry67152

 

http://www.ifsqn.com/forum/index.php/topic/21744-so-basically-we-need-to-do-the-entire-brc-audit-internally/

 

Thanks,

Bre

Dear Bre,

A few comments above.

Rgds / Charles.C

Hi All,

 

 

I was wondering what everyone's thoughts are on creating documents and approving them. Can the same person that created the document theoretically approve their document? Also, as the food safety manager, I would prefer auditing my program, because I am much harder on it than others are, so I would like to take my name off the created by and put my plants managers name on this? Any controversy with this? I know you should have your whole staff involved, but for us, its easier to have one or two main people auditing the plant as opposed to a big group of people... Let me know your thoughts.

 

Thanks,

Bre

Hi Bre,

  To my knowledge there is nothing stating you can't create your own documents....  if you created it I would say that you did and you are the one authorized to make changes, revisions etc.  As for auditing goes, we have a food safety team that audits the physical plant monthly ie. equipment, walls, ceilings and grounds etc.  But our actual internal audit is done by a sister plant which is nice because it's someone with fresh eyes that knows the standards.  (keep in mind they should have a internal auditing certificate)  If you do not have a sister plant I would recommend people educated on the standard and departments do cross auditing. ie Production audits QA, Maintenance audit HR and training etc.

Hi,

Can't this job not get done by qualified and independent third party consultants?

Balakrishnan Ramanathan,Chennai,India.

Of course you can...that's what I do for my clients.

I create the documents, The Quality manager approves them and I do all the Internal Audits as I am independent of ALL areas.

Bre in your case I'd say you should create the documents relating to your own area, and push the responsibility for other areas onto the managers of those areas. Technically you should have independence from the areas you are auditing, therefore you can't audit your own area. So you need at least one other person trained in auditing so they can audit the areas where you are  the auditee.

Someone who is totally unrelated comes in with a fresh pair of eyes and sees things you don't. However hard you feel you are on an area, your audit will always be coloured by your knowledge of what is behind the scenes ( if you know what I mean). The checklists can be created by you of course ( as the likelihood of anyone else creating them is probably slim) so you will have a hand in 'directing' the audit that way.

Documents can be prepared by the FSTL or department head but it shall be approved by senior management. While regarding Internal Audit- An auditor cannot audit his own work.