18 replies to this topic

[AltonBrownFanClub]

Good morning everyone,

 

One of our customers is now requiring GFSI certification. We have a warehouse and catering kitchen in the same building.

The catering kitchen creates sushi and other items for restaurants in the area. The warehouse holds raw ingredients for use here and in other restaurants. 

 

I am wondering which GFSI-recognized scheme everyone would suggest. We would love to obtain SQF, but I do not think it is possible at this time. I was looking at FSSC 22000, but I am a little lost.

 

Could someone suggest a checklist or something I can use to identify where the holes are?

I would like to start preparing now and shoot for early next year.

 

Open to any suggestions or things to consider as I take on this new project. Thank you!

[TimG]

I would suggest a gap assessment, but those are going to be scheme specific. If you're leaning toward SQF I'd suggest reaching out to Christina and Marty Astorga at Food Safety & Quality Systems. I've used them in the past, they are knowledgeable and won't pull any punches. 

[kfromNE]

If you want to be certified early next year - you'll need to hire someone. That isn't a lot of time. The catering kitchen - you will need to get this area exempt from the audit.

 

As for one being easier or not to put into place - it depends on what you already have in place.

 

For a checklist - you'll find these on the specific GFSI audit websites.

Edited by kfromNE, 23 November 2021 - 06:57 PM.

[kingstudruler1]

I have worked with BRC and SQF for years.   I have only glanced at FSSC.  

 

In theory, they should al be mostly similar.   For this reason, I would not exclude a standard because you don't think you are ready.   I know it seems a little overwhelming and difficult to do your first time around.   It is time consuming, but not super difficult.  

 

I agree with Tim.  The best place to start is  with the gap assessment or audit checklist for the standard.   Figure out what you have and what you are missing.    continually asking yourself how do I prove that I am in compliance with each clause.   

 

There are many of us that have created multiple programs form scratch and can help you if you get stuck.           

[Cathy]

Don't forget you can download the SQF Code and its related checklists for free. I find SQF to be the most flexible option as compared to BRC and FSSC. 

[Prasant Prusty]

I would highly recommend to go with SQF from my years of experience with various GFSI Schemes. I would be happy to assist using my SQF auditor hat. 

[MDaleDDF]

We're FSSC and I wish often we'd have gone another direction, lol.   If that helps you at all. 

[olenazh]

We're FSSC and I wish often we'd have gone another direction, lol.   If that helps you at all. 

Here I wouldn't agree: to me, FSSC is the best scheme ever. Or maybe, I'm just used to it?...

[MDaleDDF]

I think it's going to depend what one does in their building.   Certain processes lend themselves to certain schemes, or so I've heard.  So for me (us), FSSC can be a pain in small areas.   One small example:  We have to make a list every year of 'goals' to improve food safety that have to be measurable, etc.  This is one of the things I dread every year.  It's a small thing, and to me completely unimportant.   Our company has been in business over 60 years.   We're extremely low risk, nothing rte, etc.   And yet, not just this year, or the last 13 we've been FSSC, but every year until I die or retire, I'm going to have to make up some bs measurable thing to satisfy a requirement that can only be looked at as silly from my pov.   Much of the stuff in FSSC to me doesn't feel based on actually keeping food safe, but more jumping through hoops.   

So for allergens, we have 4 in our building.   Absolutely everything we make has all 4 allergens in it.   We still get hammered by inspectors on allergen control policy.   Why?   Who knows.   Cross contamination of any kind is impossible.   But every inspector does....

 

Just stuff like that.    I could go on, but it's Thanksgiving tomorrow, and my boss is in Florida............which means I'm sneaking out early and going to get a liquid lunch, then go home.
 

Happy holiday to anyone celebrating.

[olenazh]

I think it's going to depend what one does in their building.   Certain processes lend themselves to certain schemes, or so I've heard.  So for me (us), FSSC can be a pain in small areas.   One small example:  We have to make a list every year of 'goals' to improve food safety that have to be measurable, etc.  This is one of the things I dread every year.  It's a small thing, and to me completely unimportant.   Our company has been in business over 60 years.   We're extremely low risk, nothing rte, etc.   And yet, not just this year, or the last 13 we've been FSSC, but every year until I die or retire, I'm going to have to make up some bs measurable thing to satisfy a requirement that can only be looked at as silly from my pov.   Much of the stuff in FSSC to me doesn't feel based on actually keeping food safe, but more jumping through hoops.   

So for allergens, we have 4 in our building.   Absolutely everything we make has all 4 allergens in it.   We still get hammered by inspectors on allergen control policy.   Why?   Who knows.   Cross contamination of any kind is impossible.   But every inspector does....

 

Just stuff like that.    I could go on, but it's Thanksgiving tomorrow, and my boss is in Florida............which means I'm sneaking out early and going to get a liquid lunch, then go home.
 

Happy holiday to anyone celebrating.

Hey, Happy Thanksgiving Matthew! You're right about some formalities in FSSC scheme, but auditors follow their protocol. I have only 1 allergen in my yogurt facility - and yet, I have a formal Allergen Control program to comply with standard requirements. It is what it is, take it easy, eh?

[TimG]

Right behind you on the liquid lunch today and heading home after..

It was supposed to be an easy day. I already had to convince one manager that it's all going to be ok and I haven't even been here a full 2 hours yet...

Margarita is going to convince me it's all going to be ok in about 3 hours...

[Scampi]

Each scheme has very similar points of contention----allergen control (I'm in shell egg, um is it an allergen now?),  measurable objectives or goals, and of course, each auditor has their peculiarities

 

Don't forget to inquire about cost, they are not all the same and each certifying body has their own fee

 

SQF is the most popular in the USA as the guidance they use comes from the FDA 

 

Does your customer require the kitchen to be certified or just the warehouse?

[AltonBrownFanClub]

Thank you all for the great advice so far.

 

I would prefer to go SQF as it has been a company goal for some time.

 

In researching CBs, I came across the relevant Primus GFS modules and checklists. I got about halfway through them this morning. 

I haven't seen anything too difficult to implement so far. I think we could do well with this scheme after some work.

 

On the flip side, I don't have a lot of faith that employees would follow the SQF requirements longterm.

I am new to this position (6 months) and nobody ever stayed in it long enough to be considered respected.

It has been a struggle over simple issues such as PPE, logbooks, and refresher training. 

 

I really believe I could create a successful system.

I don't believe I can survive as the policymaker, babysitter, and whistleblower when everything is abandoned immediately after the audit.

[Prasant Prusty]

Make people believe what they do, your life would be easier, please feel feel to reach out for assistance, just an email away.

[TimG]

Just an FYI on the consultant I suggested above. They actually own a facility that sounds similar to yours (they use it as a training facility), with a kitchen and warehousing. Their facility is SQF certified as well.

[Cathy]

Sounds like step one is to work on the culture (which is required by SQF anyway). Folks follow rules if they understand them and are part of the process.  Don't develop the system alone. If I can be of help please let me know. I do a lot of SQF work. 

[AltonBrownFanClub]

Thank you all. Had a meeting with my boss and he is going to decide on a CB.

 

As apprehensive as I am, I kind of hope to go with SQF. Maybe that is the catalyst I need to get everyone on board. 

 

Seriously, thank you all so much. I sometimes feel alone in my work, but this community has made it so much better. <3

[Cathy]

I recommend Eagle Registrations.

[Spidey]

I second the Eagle recommendation!