9 replies to this topic

[Eric12345678]

Hello Everyone,

My name is Eric and I am new to the forum. I am a QMS Manager at a small to mid size Ice cream manufacturer and distributor in Ontario. We are in the midst of making the jump from basic CFIA requirements to HACCP and SQF. I am finding the costs for consulting and training to be fairly high. We have an old Pre req system and a very basic HACCP plan that both need some work. We have some SOP's and have been working on the system. Basically I am looking to see if these costs are reasonable. We have been quoted $16000 for training of SQF,HACCP, Internal Auditor and GMP's as well as food defense and corrective actions. This is on site training totaling ten days which seems fairly reasonable. Also there is good funding for training. Up to 83% so I am good with this one. We have also been quoted 10 onsite and 10 offsite days of consulting to assist us with the creation and implementation of the HACCP and SQF system. This is a tougher sell for my boss but I think it may be required.These 20 consulting days come in at $26200 and there seems to be no funding for consulting. So long story short do these figures seem reasonable? Any guidance is appreciated.

[Scampi]

Ok, so I know there are only really 2 amazing small/med ice cream companies in Ontario (IMHO) and I love them both, so I'm going to assume your with K or S. 

 

That actually seems reasonable, overall

 

Basic CFIA----are you saying you never followed FSEP?  

 

Sometimes, there is training money available from OMAFRA--our current leader, doesn't think this stuff is important, so there may not be any for this year.

 

I suggest you get 3 quotes from 3 different companies------last time I was looking, Dicentra was the most competitive. I had 2 really bad experienced from FFS (I'll let you figure out who they are)

 

There is also a consultant based out of Elmira way, and give NSF in Guelph a call, they have an amazing training staff

 

The diary producers of ontario should also be able to help.............I'd reach out 

[olenazh]

Ok, so I know there are only really 2 amazing small/med ice cream companies in Ontario (IMHO) and I love them both, so I'm going to assume your with K or S. 

 

That actually seems reasonable, overall

 

Basic CFIA----are you saying you never followed FSEP?  

 

Sometimes, there is training money available from OMAFRA--our current leader, doesn't think this stuff is important, so there may not be any for this year.

 

I suggest you get 3 quotes from 3 different companies------last time I was looking, Dicentra was the most competitive. I had 2 really bad experienced from FFS (I'll let you figure out who they are)

 

There is also a consultant based out of Elmira way, and give NSF in Guelph a call, they have an amazing training staff

 

The diary producers of ontario should also be able to help.............I'd reach out 

Hey Scampy, just out of curiosity: which companies names you're hiding behind "K" and "S"? If it's not confidential info:)

[Scampi]

Kawartha Dairy (OMG best in the chocolate category)

 

Shaws Dairy---the famouse moosetracks  or Grammys Cupboard 

 

 

We vacation in the kawarthas and eat it almost everyday while we're there

 

I've had to stop buying shaws (my local grocer has it) because we cannot leave it alone!!!!!!!!!!

 

And don't get me wrong, I'm also a terrific supporter of Chapmans too!

Edited by Scampi, 13 December 2021 - 05:27 PM.

[olenazh]

Thanks Scampi! I personally never tasted Shaws, and never heard of it - working myself in ice cream manufacturing. My company is St. Clair Ice Cream, their products are quite good too. They used to have a parlor on Danforth Ave, it existed for almost a century, just closed recently.

[Scampi]

Shaws is just outside St. Thomas, and been around since 1948

 

I've never heard of St Clair Ice cream either! But I bet it's all good too!

[Eric12345678]

These are all great Ice Creams but not as good as London Ice Cream Company. Thank you for the information and i recommend picking up some of our ice cream at Sobeys or Metro! You will love it! 

[kingstudruler1]

I'm might get torched for this...…

 

 

Unless you have a time restriction or don't have knowledgeable manpower, i dont recommend realying heavily on a consultant to create a food safety program.   You learn the most by doing (researching, learning, creating, implementing, etc)

 

The costs are legit.  Is the training for a couple of people or the entire staff?   Depending on what your goals  are and what the training covers might be able to save some money.   For instance, IFSQN has an internal auditor class for $97 and its pretty darn good.   

 

The 10/20 days for creation of everything does not seem realistic unless you have way more than you think you have.  

As a dairy processor, i'm guessing you have some solid practices in place.   For that reason,  I don't think that creating a program compliant with SQF will be too difficult for you.  

 

There are many of us on here that have created multiple GFSI complaint food safety programs from scratch that can help if you get stuck.   Feel free to email me if you have questions.  kingstudruler@msn.com

[SQFconsultant]

Wow. We have been involved in SQF Consulting for 14 years... those prices are just way of of whack. Considering that a simple sunscription eConsultant could easily save your company over 20,000 going out the gate and while we do not handle training We would at least point you in the proper direction.

[tahoeskier]

Request an SQF gap assessment with NSF.  It will set you in the right direction.  Feel free to contact me at fvesce@nsf.org and I can direct you accordingly.