9 replies to this topic

[S UK]

Hi all

One auditor (customer/ retailer) have raised a non conformance to us during an audit for not itemising our allergen gluten risk assessment to the various origins of gluten.  Specifically that we have not assessed our ingredient wheat flour for the possible cross-contamination with rye flour.  The wheat flour is declaring gluten (wheat) as the allergen present within it.  If rye was an intended component of the flour then rye would also be declared on ingredient declaration.  We have a spreadsheet listing all ingredients we purchase and for each ingredient we have an allergen grid containing all 14 allergens.  Each allergen states whether it is: present in product, processed on the same line, handled on site.   The auditor demanded from us to split gluten cell into further sub-groups: wheat, rye, oat, barley, and indicate the situation for each of them too.   Although the customer raised this NC, this "rule" is not described in any of the clauses of their Standard.   Have you come across this?  I have searched but I cannot find any guidance that stipulates this level of risk assessment.  All guidance stipulates to consider gluten.  

 

Any feedback is welcome.

 

Thank you

Saairah

[GMO]

May I ask which retailer?

 

Some retailers do ask that you look into your supply chain for the potential for cross contamination with other allergens.  Would I have picked this up as a risk with other gluten containing grains?  Probably not but thinking about it, why not?  I doubt that anyone with an allergy to wheat or rye doesn't have an allergy to the other but it's not impossible in other categories (e.g. tree nuts) and they definitely should be considered separately.  But it might be worth talking to some experts like RSSL to see if the different grain species are dissimilar enough to make that a valuable exercise.  Oats for example do contain different proteins (they don't actually contain gluten but are included in labelling because cross contamination is rife), however, you can also have an allergy to oat protein.  Whether you can have an allergy to oat protein and not wheat?  I'm not knowledgeable enough.

 

Is it picky?  Yes.  Is it probably good practice though?  Also yes.  RSSL are superb though and it might be worth getting a view from them on it to challenge back (if wanted) or if you're less bothered, it will probably be easier just to comply and ask your suppliers.  Field level cross contamination is rife as any long distance walker or runner knows at this time of the year so I genuinely think you'll get a "yes it's likely for everything" response.

 

Was it M&S...  Go on, tell us...  

[G M]

What is the declared allergen?  Gluten, or wheat; gluten, or rye; etc.?  Those are different things.  It sounds to me like the customer wants declarations for allergens other than the ones legislation requires.  If the customer is important enough to the business, I guess you do it, but I'd be careful about what exactly you're declaring.

[GMO]

What is the declared allergen?  Gluten, or wheat; gluten, or rye; etc.?  Those are different things.  It sounds to me like the customer wants declarations for allergens other than the ones legislation requires.  If the customer is important enough to the business, I guess you do it, but I'd be careful about what exactly you're declaring.

 

I don't think that the OP is asking about declaring on pack but the customer auditor is specifying they should be looking at this on the allergen risk assessment where there could be other grains present with risk of cross contamination in the supply chain.  The ask from the customer is to find out what that risk is and include it in the site allergen risk assessment.  For some UK retailers the standards state that you need to understand not only the risk of cross contamination on your site but also the sites of your suppliers.  That may then later inform packaging if required but I don't think that's the non conformity at this stage.

 

Under UK law, you cannot declare the allergen as "gluten".  You can put a statement under the ingredients list to say "for cereals containing gluten please see ingredients in bold" or similar.  You have to declare the specific allergen, e.g. wheat, rye, oats etc.  We still have the same legislation on this as the EU.

Edited by GMO, 04 June 2025 - 03:28 PM.

[S UK]

Hello both

Thank you very much for your feedbacks and advice / recommendation.

The issue is not with our allergen declaration on our finished products or on the ingredients we buy.  The non-conformance is that we did not risk assess the cross-contamination per each individual type of gluten-containing grain.

 

If our ingredient contains rye, oat, wheat, barley we declare it on our finished product label. If there is a possibility that any of those ingredients can be present then we would declare it under "may contain". 

 

The retailer was not M&S, although it sounds as it could be them.  It was Asda.  We are audited by all retailers every year for number of years and none of the previous auditors raised this non-conformance.  I have just received confirmation from the auditor that this requirement is not described / stipulated in any of the clauses of their Standard.  It's a tricky situation to be in.  We have 300 ingredients and if I am to amend our allergen tracker, then that will be a mammoth time consuming task.  

[S UK]

GMO, I have never contacted RSSL before.  Are you OK to share their contact email, please?  Or should I just use the "Contact Form" on their website?

 

Thank you

Kind regards

Saairah

[GMO]

I'd think the contact form will work well but the lady I've dealt with is Barbara https://www.linkedin.../barbara-hirst/

 

She's super helpful.  I have no idea about costs but she may be able to advise and she's the kind of person advising the retailers.

 

It's been a while since I've supplied Asda.  Do they use their own auditors or subcontract?  I might also subtly challenge it if you feel it is bunkum through your Technologist under the guise of "I'm not sure I understand it, before I start the work, am I ok to clarify with the standard owner...?"  That way it's polite, everyone gets to save face as it's Asda who raise it then with the auditor if it's a misinterpretation not you.  I've done that before with M&S and got derogations and even ended up advising on some of their standards.

[S UK]

Hi.

Thank you GMO for the RSSL contact and for the suggestion about how to approach the auditor. I like it a lot! Very well worded. 

 

It was Asda’s internal representative. They referred me to the FDF guidance on labelling - I’ve attached a copy. 

I gather that they are referring to the section 9, voluntary labelling (not regulated at present), i.e. "may contain wheat and rye", or "may contain other cereals containing gluten".  

 

As I understand it the auditor requires from us to implement assessment of our incoming raw materials, which contain "gluten" cereals either as a listed ingredient or under 'may contain', whether other "gluten" cereals not named on the ingredient deck could possibly be present due to cross-contamination.  

I also understand that this level of assessment is not required for incoming raw materials which don't contain any "gluten" cereals. 

I'm starting to lean towards: this is a reasonable request. 

 

Sadly, I wasn't present during the audit, I would have clarified with the auditor at the time.

 

Best wishes

 

 

[GMO]

 

Sadly, I wasn't present during the audit, I would have clarified with the auditor at the time.

 

 

No problem for the contact.  Barbara is superb and really helpful.

 

Ah not being there is a huge risk and a learning point for your team.  But it will happen.  We all made those mistakes at some point. 

 

I remember one site where I didn't agree with the wording and didn't challenge.  It just made closing it out awful and they challenged back on our close out.  So another time, having learned my lesson, when an auditor miscounted the number of non conformances, I clarified it there, in the closing meeting, in front of everyone. 

 

My site director thought I was mad but what she did was knock off one non con after we provided more evidence in the moment.  What would have been worse in my view was allowing her to leave to receive the report later when we couldn't challenge.  It was a risk but I'd always rather take that risk in the moment than wait.

[S UK]

Agreed.  I also challenge auditors during their audit if a non-conformance they are planning to raise does not make sense.  And like yourself I managed to prove that indeed we are compliant.   

 

I audit our suppliers and I know very well the importance of speaking to those persons who are the owners of the task that I am assessing / auditing.  

 

Again, thank you so much for engaging with me and leading me towards a resolution.