19 replies to this topic

[FSQAManager2025]

So, I've been working on my Supplier Approval program and making sure that everything we purchase is from approved suppliers. However, I was wondering about some of the things that we purchase from places like Walmart, CO-OP, etc. Can I approve the product itself instead of the supplier? For instance, if I get the SDS sheets, allergen statements, etc.? Thanks in advance! 

[Scampi]

it's frowned upon, as it's SUPPLIER APPROVAL and not just material approvals

 

make sure your program is clear on what you're going to do, and it should be ok, depending on the materials in question

[TimG]

Are these raw materials, ingredients, packaging, or services? Not sure how BRC handles it, but SQF calls those things out for supplier approval. In my supplier approval program, I do mention other low risk suppliers (Zorro, grainger, Airgas, etc.) and give a general blurb of what is typically purchased from them. And for chemicals will say 'see chemical approval' which is listed separately.

Like I said, this is SQF..might be different than your BRC.

[jfrey123]

If the material you're buying has any impact on food safety, it should not be purchased through basic retailers.  You have no downstream traceability in the event of a recall and cannot control how the item was handled prior to you grabbing it.

[Ishau]

Yes you can achieve this. There are some smaller manufacturers that do this who cannot order some of their raw materials in sufficient quantities from a supplier, so they go through a retailer instead.

Approve those products through clause 3.5.1.7 and make sure to define what your criteria for testing is.

[SHQuality]

You need to do supplier approval to make sure the supplier recognizes, minimizes and addresses risks, but you also need to ensure the products you receive work for the intended purpose and is of a consistent and good quality.

[GMO]

I would never do this. Sorry. I'd be looking at where else I could buy from. In the UK there is Booker for B2B which I'd use instead for example.

 

You have no trace nor knowledge of supplier site so how can you really know risk? If there was a withdrawal you might not be informed? The supplier and retailer has no knowledge of how you will be using whatever ingredients you're buying which may add shelf life. So for example, say you were cooking something into a sauce which was shelf stable, it might add a year onto the life. In the event of a recall incident but the product is out of life, a retailer will not be expecting their ingredient to be within a product still sold on the shelf for another year.

 

Oh please seek alternatives...

[jfrey123]

Yes you can achieve this. There are some smaller manufacturers that do this who cannot order some of their raw materials in sufficient quantities from a supplier, so they go through a retailer instead.

Approve those products through clause 3.5.1.7 and make sure to define what your criteria for testing is.

 

Which code are you under that uses Module 3?  I've never seen it referenced in either the Distribution or Food Manufacturing codes where I normally live, and I can't spot which code utilizes Module 3 after poking through a handful of them.

[SHQuality]

Which code are you under that uses Module 3?  I've never seen it referenced in either the Distribution or Food Manufacturing codes where I normally live, and I can't spot which code utilizes Module 3 after poking through a handful of them.

I'm not sure I understand you. No one referred to a "Module 3" before you did.

Clause 3.5.1.7 refers to a specific supplier approval requirement in the BRCGS Food Manufacturing Standard.

[FSQAManager2025]

Are these raw materials, ingredients, packaging, or services? Not sure how BRC handles it, but SQF calls those things out for supplier approval. In my supplier approval program, I do mention other low risk suppliers (Zorro, grainger, Airgas, etc.) and give a general blurb of what is typically purchased from them. And for chemicals will say 'see chemical approval' which is listed separately.

Like I said, this is SQF..might be different than your BRC.

 

I am specifically referring to maintenance materials. Such as lubricants and oils, food grade and non-food grade. 

[SHQuality]

I am specifically referring to maintenance materials. Such as lubricants and oils, food grade and non-food grade. 

The first question that comes to mind is "How do you prevent food-safe lubricants and oils and non-food grade ones from being mixed up and getting used incorrectly?"

 

The maintenance materials pose a food safety risk unless you have a procedure that manages said risks. Are the oils and lubricants on a chemical register? Have you implemented color-coding or something else to avoid someone mistakenly using the wrong material? Have you reduced the use of non-food safe oils and lubricants to an absolute minimum to limit their risk?

[GMO]

Ah so lubricants? I was imaging ingredients.

 

Seriously, why are you buying from Walmart et al? You can buy small quantities of lubricants from suppliers who will issue you with confirmation they are suitable for food contact etc. I assume you're in the US as you referenced Walmart and I don't know the companies you have there but it's easy to buy from people like RS components or directly from manufacturers in the UK presumably you can too.

 

If you REALLY want to go down that line you might be able to find technical data sheets online but I just don't know why you're making life hard for yourself if I'm honest?

[TimG]

I am specifically referring to maintenance materials. Such as lubricants and oils, food grade and non-food grade. 

Again, I'm speaking from SQF, so you will have to verify this is allowed with BRC. We order those types of items (along with TP, paper towels, cleaning supplies, hand soap, etc.) from 2 larger 'approved' suppliers (Zoro, Grainger) and on the approved supplier sheet we list them as cleaning supplies, lubricants, various and as low risk. You could absolutely put Walmart on your list if it's someone you routinely purchase these items from.  To coincide with that, all chemicals are on an approved chemical list (Controlled and inventoried) and all SDS's for those approved chemicals are kept current.

I've been doing SQF and or AIB off and on for 15 years; some plans I've inherited, some I've written, and this is always how those types of items have been handled. They come UPS, truck has no seal, we inspect boxes for damage (especially chemicals like food grade) and that's about it. That's how we do it in the US anyway.

[FSQAManager2025]

The first question that comes to mind is "How do you prevent food-safe lubricants and oils and non-food grade ones from being mixed up and getting used incorrectly?"

 

The maintenance materials pose a food safety risk unless you have a procedure that manages said risks. Are the oils and lubricants on a chemical register? Have you implemented color-coding or something else to avoid someone mistakenly using the wrong material? Have you reduced the use of non-food safe oils and lubricants to an absolute minimum to limit their risk?

 

Our food grad and non-food grade are kept in separate areas. The non-food grade are locked up. I have a list of all approved chemicals and a list of all approved suppliers. However, we purchase some lubricants from McMaster Carr. When I reached out to them to obtain supplier approval, they informed me that they do not fill out questionnaires or provide letters of guarantees because their products are commercial off-the-shelf items. We tried switching to a different lubricant under a supplier we already have approved, but the maintenance team said it isn't as good and insist on wanting the first lubricant. Which is why I'm wondering if I can just approved the lubricant itself. 

[FSQAManager2025]

Ah so lubricants? I was imaging ingredients.

 

Seriously, why are you buying from Walmart et al? You can buy small quantities of lubricants from suppliers who will issue you with confirmation they are suitable for food contact etc. I assume you're in the US as you referenced Walmart and I don't know the companies you have there but it's easy to buy from people like RS components or directly from manufacturers in the UK presumably you can too.

 

If you REALLY want to go down that line you might be able to find technical data sheets online but I just don't know why you're making life hard for yourself if I'm honest?

The company I work for is a small, family owned plant in a small town. They would rather run down the road to the local hardware store where they have credit than place a bulk order to a large corporation. I have tried to get them to only buy from approved suppliers, but then they insist on me approving the hardware stores, etc. I'm just trying to make sure that we maintain our BRC certification, so I'm caught in the middle. I'm still new to being certified myself, so I'm trying to see what all of my options are and to see if there is a middle ground. 

[Ishau]

Thanks for your clarification on the materials you were talking about. Your original post mentioned supplier approval, so it was assumed that you were talking about raw materials, but I can see above you actually meant things like lubricants.

There is no requirement to approve suppliers, you are free to purchase them however you want. They must be an approved chemical, not necessarily an approved supplier. Section 3.5 applies to raw materials so you don't need to concern yourself with supplier approval in these instances.

The specific clauses you are looking for in relation to approval (note this is product approval, not supplier approval) is clause 4.9.1.1.

You must also meet the requirements of clause 4.7.5.

[GMO]

If you want to stick with the suppliers you have then you need the data sheets for them which confirm suitability (e.g. for food contact) and lack of allergens.

 

If you can't get access to those at point of purchase, then that's a reason to move. If you can, great but I'd caution that if this is custom and practice, people will not feel any reservation in buying the brand they like best even if it's not food safe. You may lose some control on what chemicals are brought onto site and approval of those chemicals.

[SHQuality]

However, we purchase some lubricants from McMaster Carr. When I reached out to them to obtain supplier approval, they informed me that they do not fill out questionnaires or provide letters of guarantees because their products are commercial off-the-shelf items. We tried switching to a different lubricant under a supplier we already have approved, but the maintenance team said it isn't as good and insist on wanting the first lubricant. Which is why I'm wondering if I can just approved the lubricant itself. 

Thanks for the clarification. 

Does the manufacturer have any sort of quality management system they're audited for?

The strength of an approval based on the certification of a manufacturer is going to depend on the strength of the certification standard, but at least you can reasonably say that risks are being managed. Did the manufacturer have to recall any product in the last decade for a failure of their composition?

 

Do you have a product specification?

 

 

 

Our food grad and non-food grade are kept in separate areas. The non-food grade are locked up. I have a list of all approved chemicals and a list of all approved suppliers. However, we purchase some lubricants from McMaster Carr. When I reached out to them to obtain supplier approval, they informed me that they do not fill out questionnaires or provide letters of guarantees because their products are commercial off-the-shelf items. We tried switching to a different lubricant under a supplier we already have approved, but the maintenance team said it isn't as good and insist on wanting the first lubricant. Which is why I'm wondering if I can just approved the lubricant itself. 

 

[jfrey123]

I'm not sure I understand you. No one referred to a "Module 3" before you did.

Clause 3.5.1.7 refers to a specific supplier approval requirement in the BRCGS Food Manufacturing Standard.

 

Totally my mistake, I hadn't noticed we were in the BRCGS subforum... that 3.5.1.7 would indicate a Module 3 in my brain, but is totally different under BRCGS's numbering system.  Public apology for my confusion.

 

I'm enjoying and agreeing with everything else I read down to this point, especially when we're discussing non-ingredient items.  

[SHQuality]

Totally my mistake, I hadn't noticed we were in the BRCGS subforum... that 3.5.1.7 would indicate a Module 3 in my brain, but is totally different under BRCGS's numbering system.  Public apology for my confusion.

 

I'm enjoying and agreeing with everything else I read down to this point, especially when we're discussing non-ingredient items.  

No problem. Mistakes happen. I am interested to know which Module you thought we were referring to? Something in SQF?

Edited by SHQuality, Yesterday, 09:15 PM.