9 replies to this topic

[Rachuu]

I am new to the forum and I was wondering if someone can assist.

We further process different types cheese in our factory (slice,wedging,grating) and have been asked to set up product group /categories for the haccp study.

My thoughts were to categorise them as pasteurised and Unpasteurised cheese and then split them to the different types of cheese.

Is this correct?

Thanks
Rachu

[Javier Guandalini]

Rachu,
Do the process flow for each cheese. Those with same process flow or very similar can be in the same group. For your post, you say that you have two main categories, past and not past. which must be on different groups, you're right.

regards, Javier

[Rachuu]

Thanks,but all the products follow the same process flow whether it is pasteurised or Unpasteurised. So do we have to group the products on the basis of the process or the type of product. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

[Charles.C]

Thanks,but all the products follow the same process flow whether it is pasteurised or Unpasteurised. So do we have to group the products on the basis of the process or the type of product. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

Dear Rachuu,

the products follow the same process flow whether it is pasteurised or Unpasteurised.

I'm not a cheese specialist but this seems rather impossible unless the pasteurisation is done by magic ?
Perhaps you could clarify a little.

Rgds / Charles.C

[Rachuu]

:)

We don't manufacture the cheese. We buy cheese in and further process them (grate, wedge, slice etc). So for eg. If we are wedging a cheese product the process flow is the same whether it is pasteurised or Unpasteurised. Hope this clarifies :)

[Charles.C]

:)

We don't manufacture the cheese. We buy cheese in and further process them (grate, wedge, slice etc). So for eg. If we are wedging a cheese product the process flow is the same whether it is pasteurised or Unpasteurised. Hope this clarifies :)

Thks for the clarification.

IMEX the answer to yr original question particularly relates to the product/process risk assessment to the final consumer. If the various items and their associated process steps are the same plus the associated hazards / risks are also equivalent, grouping is a possible option. In practice the meaning of "same processing" is occasionally interpreted with some flexibility but IMEX the risk aspect, particularly where significant risks exist, usually not (for obvious reasons).

Offhand (not my area), i would guess that the potential hazards / risks from P/UnP cheese may differ?. Are there any critical points involved in yr processing flow chart ?.

Rgds / Charles.C

[George @ Safefood 360°]

There is no right answer to this question but usually i group products which substantially undergo the same process. On my reading HACCP is process focused refering mainly to Steps and Points (in a process). So unless there is no radical difference in the process steps I would tend to go for a general category.

You have explained that your process operations are the same whether they relate to pasturised or unpasturised product. It would appear to me that YOUR process is independent of the risks posed by different cheeses since you are not attempting to further process for hazards associated with unpasturised cheeses.

Having said that we know there are hazards associated with unpasturised cheeses compared to those that are pasturised and you would need to take account of this in your hazard analysis. For example if you were to process un-pasturised cheese before pasturised cheese without proper cleaning of equipment this may pose a risk of pathogen cross contamination. But you do not need to have seperate HACCP plans to identify and account for this in your risk assessment and CCP determination.


Just my opinon but I hope it helps.

George

[Rachuu]

Thks for the clarification.

IMEX the answer to yr original question particularly relates to the product/process risk assessment to the final consumer. If the various items and their associated process steps are the same plus the associated hazards / risks are also equivalent, grouping is a possible option. In practice the meaning of "same processing" is occasionally interpreted with some flexibility but IMEX the risk aspect, particularly where significant risks exist, usually not (for obvious reasons).

Offhand (not my area), i would guess that the potential hazards / risks from P/UnP cheese may differ?. Are there any critical points involved in yr processing flow chart ?.

Rgds / Charles.C

Thank you Charles

Yes you are correct, there are hazards/risk between pasteurised and Unpasteurised cheeses.

Just to give you an overview, the process of wedging cheese for instance is mainly manual / hand cutting using cutting boards and cheese wires. The equipment is cleaned in between product changeover and that's mainly the hazards/risk is minimised when handling pasteurised and Unpasteurised product.also where possible pasteurised cheeses are processed first and then move on to Unpasteurised cheeses.

The only Ccp in the process is metal detection !

So do we group them based on the process or the type of cheeses?

Thanks
Rachuu

[Charles.C]

Dear Rachu.

As you can see, opinions may differ somewhat.

I assume that the microbiological specifications for your respective P/UP end products will not be the same. Relevance ?.

Personally i hv experience of packing IQF (individual quick-frozen) cooked shrimp and IQF raw shrimp (not RTE unlike yr situation but assumed to be fully cooked by final consumer). The two lines are required to be totally segregated for microbiological reasons (eg pathogen xcontamination). The basic processes are identical but there are some specific PRP details which are not. IMEX it would simply be auditorily unacceptable to group them within one HACCP plan.

On the other hand, multiple choice options in school meals where a huge variety of input materials are used to produce RTE end-products but having possible process grouping leading to different haccp-CCP patterns are officially grouped based on their respective CCP combinations.

Yr original post was -

We further process different types cheese in our factory slice,wedging,grating) and have been asked to set up product group /categories for the haccp study

From yr previous post, I deduce your current HACCP plan assumes that for your process, yr prerequisite functions such as cleaning etc result in identical risks to the consumer for both P/UP cheeses and that none of these are significant other than the possibility of metal inclusion (presumably equal?).

I also assume that the risk status of both input materials has been concluded as equally non-significant to the final presentation (RTE) for the final consumer.

If so, what specific parameters is yr haccp study intending to investigate ?

Added later –

Despite my above general reservations, I hv to agree with George’s overall comment as per current info.

To elaborate my above query, your current total process of interest seems to be like [ “All Cheeses” > various manipulations > last manipulation ]
And your hazard analysis / haccp plan has concluded that the only significant hazard to the “Final Product” / consumer within the above process is metal inclusion.
So I am not quite sure what the relevance of “product grouping” is ?

With respect to the “general” aspect of “grouping” there are a few other threads here on this topic, mainly related to foodservice, eg this one which also contains some further links (esp the first URL in #3) –

http://www.ifsqn.com...dpost__p__48741

After some googling, I hv extracted a few random opinions on same topic (mostly USA) and pasted them into an excel file together with their URLs. Might be of vague interest to somebody.
 HACCP grouping(s).xls   448.5KB   46 downloads

Rgds / Charles.C

[Rachuu]

Thanks George and Charles for all the information and links shared.

Rachuu