6 replies to this topic

[Craig L.]

Please pass along any known requirements for the minimum and/or maximum distance a restroom should be from a food processing area. Most information I see states “reasonable or far enough to eliminate or minimize contamination issues verified by environmental monitoring”.

I have not found any stated distance from AIB, FDA, USDA, OSHA…

Not sure if forum is correct as this is related to sanitary design. We are planning construction and this information would be helpful if it exists.

 

Thanks,

 

Craig L.

[Chris @ Safefood 360°]

Hi Craig,

 

The GFSI standards are pretty clear regarding what will result in a non-conformance for you.

 

BRC 4.8.7:

Toilets shall be adequately segregated and shall not open directly into production, packing and storage areas. Toilets shall be provided with hand-washing facilities comprising:

1. basins with soap and water at a suitable temperature
2. adequate hand-drying facilities
3. advisory signs to prompt hand-washing.

Where hand-washing facilities within toilet facilities are the only facilities provided before re-entering production, the requirements of 4.8.6 shall apply and signs shall be in place to direct people to hand-wash facilities before entering production.

 

SQF 11.3.9.1

 

Toilet rooms shall be:

i. Designed and constructed so that they are accessible to staff and separate from any processing and

food handling operations;

ii. Accessed from the processing area via an airlock vented to the exterior or through an adjoining room;

iii. Sufficient in number for the maximum number of staff;

iv. Constructed so that they can be easily cleaned and maintained; and

v. Kept clean and tidy.

 

If you are not GFSI certified yet, but are planning to be in the future you can save yourself a headache and more money if you ensure that you meet the GFSI standards today.

 

Thanks,
Chris

[Charles.C]

Getting a little OT but slight excuse for some nitty-gritty.

IMO both  “definitions” in previous post are ambiguous by omission. They facilitate a hygienic compromise(s). Whether by intention I have never quite decided.

 

IMEX, a factory employee communal “toilet” is typically an  enclosed  2 part area, eg a  row of (often tiny) individual cubicles  + a multi-functional external portion servicing all cubicle exitees. 3 simple hygiene questions,  – (a) has anyone ever encountered soap within a cubicle ? (b) has anyone ever seen anybody actually cleaning / washing the components which activate flushing mechanisms within a cubicle / included within a SOP ? © has anyone ever encountered a toilet hygiene NC event due to an unannounced audit ?  My answers would be 3 x No, not yet applicable.

 

The cautionary tales associated with (b)-type factors, eg cubicle door handles  are of course legendary and sometimes hilarious although relevant data analysis is less common.

Where paranoia takes over from hygienic reality has AFAIK never been  quantitated.

 

Neither of the definitions in post #2, as far as I can see, directly answers the OP except by an implied acceptance of something like (a) as below. I cannot remember ever having seen an actual minimum dimension quoted anywhere. It probably doesn’t exist.  IMEX I have seen anything from (a) near-zero distance >  a bootwash step > (near zero) a plastic separation curtain up to (b) initial walkways of a few, probably random, metres. Both scenarios have never seemed to cause any auditorial comments.

 

Would be an interesting topic for a thesis though.

 

Rgds / Charles.C

[imadoughguy]

Measure how far it is from the processing area to the rest rooms, next time you get the "urge" walk around that distance before going into the restroom, if you make it without an accident or major discomfort, the rest rooms are surely close enough. My guess would be 100 feet max.

 

Now hand washing is another story, they need to be within a distance that encourages (rather than discourages) hand washing. Probably less than 50 feet from the processing area?

 

I bet your architect or building designer will have a opinion on both. :-)

 

Phil

[Mr. Incognito]

SQF doesn't designate a distance from what I remember. I'll look in the code later but the only thing it said, I believe, was that restrooms could not open into production rooms.  So basically they need to be separated physically from production but no distance was suggested.

[Craig L.]

Thank You all for this information.

I have since spoken to a State Food Division Sdministrator for the USDA and as you might imagine, common sense was mentioned.

As for Imadoughguy-prostate status is a variable which cannot support this experiment.

 

Thanks again,

 

Craig L.

[scppvjune]

Agree with Charles.

Toilets should not be too far since it might be inconvenient for the workers (to walk far away for toilets and in case of emergency, it can create a mess - oop! sorry if anyone think this is disgusting). Physical separate from production areas (double doors) with proper ventilation should be okay.

Mostly, I found toilets are located at the changing areas before entering the processing areas due to the workers can take off thier protective gears and leave those gears at the changing areas before using the toilets and of course the workers need to clean and sanitize hands (again eventhough they have already cleaned hands after using toilets) before entering the processing areas.

I believe auditors just looking for the risk of cross contamination from toilets to the production areas. If you can prove that areas and ventilation are segregated; protective gears, including footwear, are removed/changed; and personel hygiene is under control....I think all auditors, including GFSI auditors, and authorities should be okay and satisfied.