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Is it acceptable - common process flow chart, common hazard analysis?

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Anish

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 01:13 PM

Dear Friends,

 

I want to ask you one general question which is not acceptable to me - please give your views:

 

If the process flow of the product is different - for example 4 different process - Is it ok to have same common flow chart for all the 4 different process categoy, common hazard analysis and common HACCP Plan  - The CCP's are not the same for all the flow chart - in some CCP 1, 3,4  is there in some all CCP is there - but the CCP limits are same...

 

If I want to tell - this is not justifiable to have common hazard analysis - I have to tell which clause of ISO 22K is asking to keep the different flow chart for the product... I hope you got my point.

 

Pls. clarify.

 

Rgds,

Anish





Charles.C

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 07:46 PM

Dear Friends,

 

I want to ask you one general question which is not acceptable to me - please give your views:

 

If the process flow of the product is different - for example 4 different process - Is it ok to have same common flow chart for all the 4 different process categoy, common hazard analysis and common HACCP Plan  - The CCP's are not the same for all the flow chart - in some CCP 1, 3,4  is there in some all CCP is there - but the CCP limits are same...

 

If I want to tell - this is not justifiable to have common hazard analysis - I have to tell which clause of ISO 22K is asking to keep the different flow chart for the product... I hope you got my point.

 

Pls. clarify.

 

Rgds,

Anish

 

Dear Anish,

 

IMO, ISO22000 does not explicitly set a definite limitation. But a limitation may still exist.

 

The iso22000 standard states “this internationl standard integrates the principles of the Hazard Analysis and Critical Control Point (HACCP) system and application steps developed by the Codex Alimentarius Commission”.

 

The Codex HACCP guidelines state –

 

The flow diagram should be constructed by the HACCP team (see also paragraph 1 above).  The flow diagram should cover all steps in the operation for a specific product.  The same flow diagram may be used  for  a  number  of  products  that  are  manufactured  using  similar  processing  steps.    When  applying HACCP  to  a  given  operation,  consideration  should  be  given  to  steps  preceding  and  following  the specified operation.

 

 

AFAIK, the ISO22000 standard only explicitly requires compliance with para..7.3.5.1.

 

Accordingly it should depend on the interpretation of the Codex  “similar”.

 

IMEX (not iso22000) auditors have no problem where the alternative overall routes within a composite flow diagram have the same CCPs. Otherwise it becomes more problematic.

I have seen (haccp) textbook examples where different processes have the same mainline but with varying loops within the mainline so that overall process routes have different CCPs. This was pictorially handled by showing  additional, labelled, flow “diagrams” for the loops within the same page and indicating the location of the loops on the mainline flow line. Individual hazard analyses for the separate loops were then presented within their respective contexts of the main plan.

However, depending on the actual process(es), the overall analysis could eventually get so complicated  that  it may ultimately be more logical to use separate flowcharts. This scenario  IMO could cause an audit problem, ie it may depend on the specific case.

 

Rgds / Charles.C


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


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jonboy47

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 10:32 PM

Dear Anish,

 

IMO, ISO22000 does not explicitly set a definite limitation. But a limitation may still exist.

 

The iso22000 standard states “this internationl standard integrates the principles of the Hazard Analysis and Critical Control Point (HACCP) system and application steps developed by the Codex Alimentarius Commission”.

 

The Codex HACCP guidelines state –

 

 

AFAIK, the ISO22000 standard only explicitly requires compliance with para..7.3.5.1.

 

Accordingly it should depend on the interpretation of the Codex  “similar”.

 

IMEX (not iso22000) auditors have no problem where the alternative overall routes within a composite flow diagram have the same CCPs. Otherwise it becomes more problematic.

I have seen (haccp) textbook examples where different processes have the same mainline but with varying loops within the mainline so that overall process routes have different CCPs. This was pictorially handled by showing  additional, labelled, flow “diagrams” for the loops within the same page and indicating the location of the loops on the mainline flow line. Individual hazard analyses for the separate loops were then presented within their respective contexts of the main plan.

However, depending on the actual process(es), the overall analysis could eventually get so complicated  that  it may ultimately be more logical to use separate flowcharts. This scenario  IMO could cause an audit problem, ie it may depend on the specific case.

 

Rgds / Charles.C

 

As usual, a great answer from Charles.  I think he's absolutely right.  It just goes back to what's most efficient, effective, and manageable to ensure that all hazards are addressed and managed to ensure a safe product.  I think it's safe to say that if two processes or products are substantially different, they should NOT be in the same flow diagram or hazard analysis, but should be separated.

 

Disclaimer, I haven't spent the time digging into any of the GFSI standards to see what they say about this.  So my opinion is primarily based on the Codex requirements.

 

Jon





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