8 replies to this topic

[astro]

Hi

 

I have just had our BRC V8 audit and I got a non conformance for 1.1.4 No annual review on suppliers or service providers. Now I have read the standards again including the interpretation and I cant see anywhere in the standards that state this.

 

Unless I am missing it, I would be grateful for your comments regarding this.

 

Cheers

[SafetyLine]

Hello!

 

I'm works in a BRC plant, in my short experience I've not seen an annual review specifically about suppliers or services provider, are you sure about the number of the clause? I think it could be wrong. I also just read that clause and 3.5 Approval and monitoring of suppliers and raw materials, and not found nothing about that.

 

Maybe the auditor refers that point with the review of efficacy of authenticity of raw materials and products.

 

I hope my comments can help you.

 

Regards

[zanorias]

I'm wondering if it's in relation to clause 3.5.3.1:

 

There shall be a procedure for the approval and monitoring of suppliers of services. Such services shall include, as appropriate:

- pest control

- laundry services

- contracted cleaning

- contracted servicing and maintenance of equipment

- transport and distribution

- off-site storage of ingredients, packaging or products

- off-site packing of products

- laboratory testing

- catering services

- waste management

 

This approval and monitoring process shall be risk-based and take into consideration:

- risk to the safety and quality of products

- compliance with any specific legal requirements

- potential risks to the security of the product (i.e. risks identified in the vulnerability and food defence assessments).

 

The interpretation for this clause includes:

 

The performance of the supplier should be formally reviewed at a frequency appropriate to the service.

... Other services such as pest control or laundry, may be reviewed with the supplier on a 6-monthly or annual bass and a record kept of the review (e.g. minutes of the meeting).

 

Going back to clause 1.1.4 (management review meetings), do you cover and document the above in these meetings?

[pHruit]

I started typing a long but entirely speculative post on this and then changed my mind.

In your position I'd be somewhat disappointed with the auditor - really they should be identifying what it is that they think is missing/noncompliant as they find it, and then going through it with you to ensure it is clear when they issue you the NCs in the closing meeting.
If you're not sure about exactly what you're noncompliant with then it sounds like this didn't happen? In which case I'd contact the auditor and ask them to clarify, otherwise you're potentially going to end up trying to address an inferred issue that is different to the actual one the auditor wants you to look at.

 

As per Zanorias' post, there is a requirement to review the performance of service providers in clause 3.5.3.1, and in clause 3.5.1.3 there is the equivalent requirement for suppliers - "There shall be a documented process for ongoing supplier performance review, based on risk and defined performance criteria. The process shall be fully implemented."

[john.kukoly]

Always a challenge to try to interpret audit results without the auditor's full perspective. That being said, you noted the non-conformance was against 1.1.4. Correct in that it is not specifically called out as an agenda topic for senior management review, it isn't actually a bad idea to add, assuming you are more focused on performance than the audit results.

 

Senior management being aware, and ensuring that suppliers of both service and components are not having a negative effect on the operation is a valid ask. Easy ti incorporate into the agenda, and if there are no issues to report, easy to check off. Speculation on the intent of the NC.

[Leila Burin]

Helllo,

Most probably it was a typo.... it makes no sense.

Also, auditors shall leave the proposed NC in the closing meeting,

 

best regards

Leila

[mgourley]

Hi

 

I have just had our BRC V8 audit and I got a non conformance for 1.1.4 No annual review on suppliers or service providers. Now I have read the standards again including the interpretation and I cant see anywhere in the standards that state this.

 

Unless I am missing it, I would be grateful for your comments regarding this.

 

Cheers

What was the specific NC raised?
Were you not monitoring or reviewing these suppliers. Were you not discussing these reviews in Management Review meetings? Something else?

 

Since it's a NC against 1.1.4, I'm going to assume that these reviews were not discussed in Management Review meetings.

It's a simple enough fix to add an agenda item to the Review to include results of internal audits, which you should be doing already. Just mention in your meeting minutes "3.5.3 Management of Suppliers of Services: No non-conformances noted".

 

Marshall

 

Marshall

Edited by mgourley, 26 June 2019 - 08:21 PM.

[astro]

Thanks for your comments

 

I have just added to agenda at management meeting to discuss

 

Thanks

[ilonar]

I read 1.1.4 to see if it is a requirement there, because somehow I have this point of discussion in the agenda. It is nowhere written that you have to discuss supplier approval during the management review, but in case you overthink "resource requirements", you can somehow reach to the discussion about your suppliers. I normally write that we replaced some suppliers or we have new suppliers because of changes in activities (new packaging material, new way of monitoring the storage temperature).

 

Personally i don't think that it has nothing to do with results of internal audits, as supplier approval is audited during an internal audit. In the management review I would just put that we had 4 audits last year, done by....., no major non-conformities were identified. As supplier approval is mainly linked in BRC with the supplier being also GFSI certified, there is no need to do an audit on the premises of the supplier. And for incidents/preventive actions, I assume that this is also different from supplier review. Of course you can analyze non-conformities raised against suppliers, but it doesn't have to do with supplier approval.

 

I have to agree with what was already posted by other members. After each audit that we had, during the closing meeting (which is planned to last at least 30 minutes), we discussed the audit report. As we had every year another auditor, but the discussion was always the same. The auditor explains each non-conformity, what he saw or couldn't find in a procedure, and the end result of the audit. It is also in their benefit if the company understand what the non-conformity is, and in most of the cases you can already get an idea how to solve it at that moment. Or if you are lucky enough, you realize that what the auditor wants to see is written somewhere else (this never happened with us, but it is always possible). If 3 days later you have no idea what was wrong and what you should do to correct it, you will either send the wrong corrective action or start bothering the auditor. And probably they don't have time for this. So they have to make sure that you understood the report. And then you always have that survey from BRC after you receive the certificate, when they ask if communication with the certification body and auditor was ok.