13 replies to this topic

[Cheesecakes & Cake]

Hello,

Anyone else been affected by the BS recall for metal...

 

If we can prove that our own MD's are in working order, hourly checks, calibrated etc...

Can we get around the full recall even if the supplier is issuing?

 

There saying a failure for 3 minutes, allowed "316 s/s swarf" into bags...

But surely if our in house MD's can detect 316 s/steel.......

 

Ideas....

[Setanta]

Hello,

Anyone else been affected by the BS recall for metal...

 

If we can prove that our own MD's are in working order, hourly checks, calibrated etc...

Can we get around the full recall even if the supplier is issuing?

 

There saying a failure for 3 minutes, allowed "316 s/s swarf" into bags...

But surely if our in house MD's can detect 316 s/steel.......

 

Ideas....

 

Interesting, could you share a link for more details for Non-British QA? I am not familiar with this recall.

[Cheesecakes & Cake]

Interesting, could you share a link for more details for Non-British QA? I am not familiar with this recall.

 

It just been raised, it only affects x10 pallet in the UK so don't know think it will make its way to the USA

[Setanta]

Thanks, that wasn't my concern, I was trying to help you out...

[TimG]

MMM...no I wouldn't if I were you. I speak from experience that it could be they found shavings BELOW the threshold to set off metal detection.

Also, I'm not sure on UK law, but if an ingredient is recalled here stateside and a company uses said ingredient..Hell I honestly don't know what would happen. The ingredient manufacturer would alert FDA here that the customer 'refused to destroy' and I'm pretty sure FDA would push the ingredient user to destroy all product made with it.

[Cheesecakes & Cake]

Thanks, that wasn't my concern, I was trying to help you out...

 

 

I cant share a link as hasnt been raised to FSA etc.

What other information can i provide to assist?

 

I have stated a supplier has issued a METAL recall, saying they have had a MD failure during there production, however our MD's have been working correctly...

Thus can i justify not recalling the +5k of cakes .... as they have been passed through my own MD?

[MDaleDDF]

If it's a recall, I wouldn't mess with it honestly.... that would really suck, but if it's a recall are you not obligated?

[jfrey123]

I didn't realize participating in a recall was optional in the UK.  Food recalled for FM contamination would be considered adulterated in the US and using it afterward would mean mandatory recall of your finished goods.  Hell, the purposeful use of it after receiving a recall notice could bring official warning letters and borderline on actual criminal charges (depending on the severity).

[Cheesecakes & Cake]

...

 

Its not an official recall, not UK wide, is from the supplier! As they want to "screen" the product, ie they want to MD it again....

 

The supplier has advised that they have had an MD failure.

 

The question i have , if i can prove that all the product went through OUR own MD's is this suitable?

 

From the way people jumped on, i will ask my certification body for clarity...

 

TY

[Cheesecakes & Cake]

MMM...no I wouldn't if I were you. I speak from experience that it could be they found shavings BELOW the threshold to set off metal detection.

Also, I'm not sure on UK law, but if an ingredient is recalled here stateside and a company uses said ingredient..Hell I honestly don't know what would happen. The ingredient manufacturer would alert FDA here that the customer 'refused to destroy' and I'm pretty sure FDA would push the ingredient user to destroy all product made with it.

 

The supplier has been asked to provide the FB's so they can be put through MD to validate that our internal MD's are sensitive enough to detect!

[G M]

...

There saying a failure for 3 minutes, allowed "316 s/s swarf" into bags...

But surely if our in house MD's can detect 316 s/steel.......

 

 

The liability for FM injury is going to be far higher if you use material that you know was recalled for that reason.  Your insurance is very likely to refuse to cover you for knowingly ignoring the recall warning.

[PrplomSolved]

...

 

Its not an official recall, not UK wide, is from the supplier! As they want to "screen" the product, ie they want to MD it again....

 

The supplier has advised that they have had an MD failure.

 

The question i have , if i can prove that all the product went through OUR own MD's is this suitable?

 

From the way people jumped on, i will ask my certification body for clarity...

 

TY

 

 

your own MD should fulfill the need, but you would virtually be taking on the risk as your supplier let you know they wanted to do an additional MD due to failure. 

 

At least, thats how I imagine it would play out

[MDaleDDF]

I didn't realize participating in a recall was optional in the UK.  Food recalled for FM contamination would be considered adulterated in the US and using it afterward would mean mandatory recall of your finished goods.  Hell, the purposeful use of it after receiving a recall notice could bring official warning letters and borderline on actual criminal charges (depending on the severity).

Agreed, I'm confused.    Is this a difference for us and the UK?   You have don't have to participate in a recall?   The company recalled it, but it's not a recall?   So it's what I've heard called here a 'market withdrawal', which to me is BS...

They want it back to screen it.   So none of it has been converted to finished product and reached the market?   Do you have the entire lot?  If you haven't converted it to finished product yet, it seems really easy to just let them have it back.   Tell them to send a truck with replacement, and load the offending lot and send it back?

 

Agree with those have said you're letting yourself hang in the wind if you don't recall it.    IF something happens, it's going to be a really big issue.

 

IF this were me, I'd leave it up to people higher up the chain.   I would assemble HACCP team to discuss, and personally recommend we recall our stuff, but leave it to the company ownership/CEO/board/team to make the actual decision.   Then you're personally absolved regardless.

Edited by MDaleDDF, Today, 02:47 PM.

[GMO]

I just went hunting to the FSA website and saw it's not on there.

 

So it's a withdrawal not a recall. 

 

The legislation in the UK is around "knowing or have reason to believe" something is not food safe.

 

As I understand it from what you've said above, what has happened is the supplier with the unfortunate acronym have contacted you to say there "may" be an issue in some product they have supplied but have not recalled it.  They are wanting to withdraw it for more data etc.

 

Now, this is where I'd kick off my crisis team.  The supplier has approached you with a softly softly intent not trying to set hares running... But the problem is you've used some of the sugar, is that correct?

 

This is where I'd be alerting your crisis team (and the responsible person needs to alert your insurers as well) but the first priority is, in my mind, if your crisis team agree, to go back to the supplier, explain some of the sugar has been used AND GET THEM to explain how much of a risk they think it is.  In the meantime, get everything ready, everything traced and I'd be putting nothing else on the market made with those batches until I knew more but I wouldn't recall yet until I got a clear answer from the suppliers.

 

This is a consumer risk issue and an insurance issue but the latter is on two fronts.  

 

For the American readers, no this would not be classed as "adulterated" stock and it sounds very much like the supplier has not contacted the competent authorities.  It might simply be the supplier doesn't know or it might be a slight fishing expedition to find out how far product has been used.

 

As for if it's a risk when it's been through your metal detection?  Good idea to get a sample of the material.  But if you find it DOES detect in your equipment and you've not had any activations, all that will do is make you worried your staff haven't followed the procedure.  Sorry I'm just warning you...  You might then still decide to pull it back depending on how widespread and how much metal could be in it.  In the background your finance guys might want to be checking how much liability the supplier signed up to in their contract.