15 replies to this topic

[stephie]

Dear All:

Morning and thanks 1st.
I want to implement HACCP in a bird nest industries, have any one have such experience or ideal, source can help me??Thanks.....have a nice day!!

warm regards,
Stephie

[Jean]

Dear Stephi,



Interesting to know about the bird nest industries and can you throw light on the activity involved in the industry. Is it part of the tourism industry or in a resort ?

[Simon]

Dear All:

Morning and thanks 1st.
I want to implement HACCP in a bird nest industries, have any one have such experience or ideal, source can help me??Thanks.....have a nice day!!

warm regards,
Stephie

Hi Stephie,

I too would love to know what you do with the birds nests. What is your process?

Regards,
Simon

[AS NUR]

DEar stephie..

Is your industry same with farming industry like ranch ?

[stephie]

Dear all:

Thanks...Actually is a quite new industries. there are also a normal manufacturer and processing factory. some thing like, get the raw bird nest from supplier then do cleaning, drying, molding, packing as well.Because of is quite new industries so, is hard to get some M/o hazard reference, regulation for the finished products.
Any one can help??Thanks and have a nice day!!!

regards,
Stephie

[rita]

Hi Stephi,



It’s nice to hear about a new industry.

So the activities involved do not deal with any food handling! Again out of curiosity would like to know why you require HACCP.

[AS NUR]

dear stephi..

IMO...there are some micro hazard in your process :

1. Cleaning process : Staphylococus, E Coli, Listeria.. That hazard came from dirty Nest..

2. Drying Process ; as same as cleaning process.. but you have to control the temp. and time of darying and the moist content

3.Molding ; ( i dont know what is the process)

4. Packing : E. Coli, Listeria etc.. thats micro hazard came from the people and the environment of packing room...

[Suzuki]

For those who wish to know if this is a new industry, the answer is no. Its been around for thousands of years but only recently developed into a massive business ever since the spending power from China became so ever visible because the consumers for "double-boiled" bird nest are largely "chinese consumers"

Only the spectacular bird nest developed from the saliva of certain species of swallows can be used and categorized as consumable. Others are made from just twigs and impediments of some sort!

My advice - Developing a HACCP Program for this industry is certainly viable. Since the "bird nest premise" is generally an enclosed structure / santuary with exit / entrance using "pigeon holes" and with the droppings within it, its a haven for microbial.

Targeted pathogens are likely to be Salmonella, Campylobactor, E. Coli etc

Your most dangerous hazard would likely be Avian Influenza due to co-mingling of birds

By the way, I had taken it before and is not likely to take it again.

Edited by Suzuki, 31 October 2008 - 04:50 AM.

[Hongyun]

Hi Stephie,

Since you're into Bird Nest, maybe you can confirm if the forward message as per attached, is the usual way to manufacture it?

If it is, then, are the bleaches or hydrogen peroxide removed (via boiling water?) sufficiently for safe consumption?

Just FYI, I also found the following:

-----
Re: What are nutrition values of bird's nest of oriental Collocalia sp.?
Date: Thu Apr 7 18:13:24 2005
Posted By: Peter Bosani, Independent
Area of science: Biochemistry
ID: 1109976591.Bc Message:

Hello, NHIEM.

This type of bird takes its name from the nests used in a soup, called bird's nest soup. It's very expensive, up to $10,000 per kg! One kilogram, however, means the loss of about 105 nests, each nest containing 1 or 2 eggs. Obviously this can have a negative impact on these swiftlets.

Chemical analyses by Massimo Marcone of the University of Guelph found that this bird's nest soup contains a protein similar to one found in eggs. He has found that this can lead to allergies. In fact, in Singapore, birds's nest soup is the leading cause of food allergies!

What you must realize is that this soup is simply hardened bird spit. Saliva is not nutritious, and bird's nest soup is no exception. It does contain some enzymes, salts, and mostly water. The saliva also contains some natural type of antibiotic. There is some research to see if the saliva can be used to control cell division. However, there really is no scientific evidence to justify any nutritional or health claims made for it.

In fact, it can be downright dangerous, as environmental contamination has turned up in bird's nest soup in Vietnam from arsenic. A Vietnamese man was poisoned from arsenic intoxication after consuming bird's nest soup! This was written up in the American Journal of Medical Sciences in April, 1999. (Luong KV, Nguyen LT. Organic arsenic intoxication from bird's nest soup. Am J Med Sci. 1999 Apr;317(4):269-71.)

You can find out more on the following web sites:

www.amjmedsci.com

www.ladyshrike.com/birds.htm

I realize that there is much good that comes out of Asian medicine. But we must be able to prove our claims, and in the case of bird's nest soup, I'm afraid there is precious little evidence to justify the intrusion on their population or the justification for such exorbitant prices.

Good luck.

Peter Bosani

-----

http://www.madsci.or...22484.Bc.r.html

Attached Files

•  Bird__s_nest.pdf   702.64KB   96 downloads

[Jean]

Hi Hongyun,

Thanks for the document on bird nest processing and now I have got a better picture of its usage as food. Thanks to Stephi to bring up the topic.

[AS NUR]

yup.. thanks for the info hongyun.. thats make me clear about "bird nest" industry

[Simon]

Thank you Hongyun very interesting. I watched a tv program about birds nest soup many years ago when I was a little lad. I think it was Whickers World, Alan Whicker. For those who can remember him in the UK.

[Charles.C]

Dear All,

Superb link Hongyun

There is more background info here -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bird's_nest_soup

I have eaten this item but I think would hv declined if reading this thread before. I agree slightly regarding the flavour as per this extracted chunk of a fascinating journey by the Independent reporter in Borneo.

Bird's nest soup makes its appearance in one of the Doctor Dolittle stories, and I had always been fascinated by the idea. The swallows build their nests in limestone caves at Gomantong, about 12 miles from Sandakan. As you approach you pass the wooden huts of the nest collectors, who gather them with long, shaky wooden ladders and lots of courage. The incentive is money - about pounds 2,000 per kilo of nest.
As we entered the cathedral-sized cavern we were struck by an acrid stench. As our eyes adjusted to the darkness we realised that it was filled with a million wings; swallows, bats and insects. I swung a torch down and saw that I was wading ankle-deep in guano. I looked closer and I realised that the stuff was seething with life.
Insects of all kinds crawled in a loathsome manner across the floor. As we penetrated further, cockroaches crunched underfoot. At least six separate phobias were catered for in this noisome place.
As I staggered out into the sunlight I found that I was liberally bespattered with birdshit - in my hair, on my feet, on my clothes. Looking up into the trees my eyes met those of a orang-utan, the only one I'd seen outside a park. For a moment we both seemed to be wondering which one of us was the Wild Man of Borneo.
THE NESTS are made by swallows of the genus Collocali. What makes them remarkable is that the birds line them with saliva and pre- digested seaweed, which hardens to a translucent layer. There are many grades; the whiter, and the fewer feathers, the better. I bought two biscuit-sized pieces in the shape of hearts (they are an alleged aphrodisiac) for about pounds 15. They look a bit like nest, but there is no smell and little taste, their function being to provide texture to the soup. Simmered for three hours it tastes a bit like woven gelatin, or a well boiled loofah.

http://findarticles....s_/ai_n14167620

[Jean]

Dear Charles,



Hopefully the reporter had a fascinating trip to learn and experience the making of bird nest. Aerodramus Fuciphagus (Swiflet) houses are becoming a potentially lucrative income in the Malaysia, Indonesia and Thailand.



After a look into the IT found a health care tip on Bird nest:-



Chinese believe that this layer of saliva is rich in protein and vitamins. Ladies consider bird's nest one of the best beauty aids. They believe the protein and vitamins in the nest rejuvenate the complexion, smoothes the skin and keep them looking young.
The Bird Nest also good for lungs, digestion and helps to prevent overall dryness while boosting the immune system.



http://www.aerodramus.com/page3.html

[Hongyun]

Hi guys,

Am glad that the attachment I provided was interesting reading material. Bird nest is a very common item here in Asia and I thought that the merchants might bring this very profitable item to other European countries as well.

I wouldn't say it is very tasty, just rock sugar to provide the sweetness and like the article from Charles, the nest to provide texture... But as long as people believe in the health benefit claims, this business is going to strive very well... I guess it is the placebo effect that causes people to buy them.

Edited by Hongyun, 20 November 2008 - 01:06 PM.

[Simon]

Hi guys,

Am glad that the attachment I provided was interesting reading material. Bird nest is a very common item here in Asia and I thought that the merchants might bring this very profitable item to other European countries as well.

I wouldn't say it is very tasty, just rock sugar to provide the sweetness and like the article from Charles, the nest to provide texture... But as long as people believe in the health benefit claims, this business is going to strive very well... I guess it is the placebo effect that causes people to buy them.

As a European I just asked myself would I eat a birds nest. If it was on a supermaket shelf probably not, but if I were in the country of origin on vacation or business probably yes. I don't think it would take off in the UK, but I could be wrong.

Regards,
Simon