35 replies to this topic

[Simon]

Please select the GFSI recognised scheme for manufacturers that is doing best in your country. It would be useful if you could comment also on your choice and your country of residence.

Thanks,
Simon

[Simon]

Without any doubt in the UK it has to be the BRC Food Standard. On their website the BRC claim 14,000 companies operating in over 90 countries are Certified to their standards. They were the first and are the biggest pretty much the only FSMS standard for food manufacturers in the UK. I cannot see that changing. It helps to be early. The first edition of the BRC Food Stanadard was published in 1998.

[Charles.C]

Dear Simon,

Just a thought -

I appreciate you were trying to ensure logical (GFSI) responses but might hv been interesting to add ISO 22000 as a specific "other"

Rgds / Charles.C

[GMO]

I clicked on BRC as anyone who is making for a UK retailer seems to need it as well as being a requirement for "red tractor" certification. Some older branded industries in the UK don't use it yet but they're mostly seeing the light and transferring across. I don't think BRC is perfect but I do think there are some older branded factories (confectioners, I'm talking to you) who would struggle to pass if they took it whereas the own branded factories are leading the way. Whether that's the BRC influence or the retailers influence, I suspect the latter. Having built a factory for branded foods and had to fight for every food safety decision, having that retailer pressure makes all of the difference.

[Simon]

We need a few more votes to make this survey statistically reliable.

Please vote.

[tsmith7858]

We need a few more votes to make this survey statistically reliable.

Please vote.

SQF appears to have the edge in the US but most customer are willing to accept any of the GFSI accepted. We held BRC for a specific customer and process and when we recently upgrade our exisitng ISO 22000 to FSSC 22000 that customer accepted FSSC and is letting us drop the BRC (global company and we work with both the US and UK divisions and originally needed BRC for UK product).

Another large retail chain in the US has stated they want suppliers accepted to a GFSI approved standard but did not specify which one.

I guess some people are starting to realize that GFSI benchmarked them and called them "equivalent" for a reason.

[Simon]

SQF appears to have the edge in the US but most customer are willing to accept any of the GFSI accepted. We held BRC for a specific customer and process and when we recently upgrade our exisitng ISO 22000 to FSSC 22000 that customer accepted FSSC and is letting us drop the BRC (global company and we work with both the US and UK divisions and originally needed BRC for UK product).

Another large retail chain in the US has stated they want suppliers accepted to a GFSI approved standard but did not specify which one.

I guess some people are starting to realize that GFSI benchmarked them and called them "equivalent" for a reason.

Hi TS, yes from my experience and from the interest in the manuals SQF is the standard of choice in the USA. It's good to hear though that GFSI standards are being accepted like for like. I think GFSI was too late for the UK. Thanks for the update.

[Charles.C]

Dear tsmith,

Slightly Off-topic but seemed worth a query -

SQF appears to have the edge in the US

Is there any obvious reason why ?

I wondered if it was because the English used seems more "understandable".?

Having just examined some of SQF 2000's content related to a running post here, it seemed incredibly full of waffle in some places. Surprised the Americans go for this style.

I suspect the real reason may be more mundane such as cost of implementation / auditing / audit frequencies / "local clout"

Rgds / Charles.C

[tsmith7858]

Dear tsmith,

Slightly Off-topic but seemed worth a query -



Is there any obvious reason why ?

I wondered if it was because the English used seems more "understandable".?

Having just examined some of SQF 2000's content related to a running post here, it seemed incredibly full of waffle in some places. Surprised the Americans go for this style.

I suspect the real reason may be more mundane such as cost of implementation / auditing / audit frequencies / "local clout"

Rgds / Charles.C

I don't know that there is an obvious reason why but it was picked up by Walmart and some of the other large retails at first so there was a push from them. Walmart has more recently said "any GFSI" will do but most were already on the way towards SQF.

BRC was viewed as the "UK Standard" so unless you have business in the UK it was not pushed. I think if ISO 22000 would have come out benchmarked, it would have been at the top of the list. FSSC 22000 is still to new for most.

[Simon]

I don't know that there is an obvious reason why but it was picked up by Walmart and some of the other large retails at first so there was a push from them. Walmart has more recently said "any GFSI" will do but most were already on the way towards SQF.

BRC was viewed as the "UK Standard" so unless you have business in the UK it was not pushed. I think if ISO 22000 would have come out benchmarked, it would have been at the top of the list. FSSC 22000 is still to new for most.

A standard with a title beginning with the word "British" was always going to struggle to make it on the world stage. Even though they added the word "Global" at a later date.

[QLD]

SQF seems to edge it at the moment but BRC is becoming more popular.

Edited by QLD, 30 December 2010 - 11:14 PM.

[Simon]

SQF is going from strength to strength in USA/Candaa, I can see that with private communications I have with members and customers and here on the forums. I still believe FSSC 22000 will take off this year.

[mgourley]

We are going to pursue BRC simply because it was "recommended" by one of our third party auditors.
Wholesale bakeries and those catering to the QSR segment here in the US really have not had much impetus to decide on a standard. The main reason for that is our customers, by and large, have not required a standard. As long as you scored a "Superior" on your AIB audits, you were good to go.
With the passage of the Food Safety Modernization Act, it's apparent that a traditional HACCP based approach will no longer be enough. Even though BRC is HACCP based, it has a bit more "teeth" if you will, than the SQF standards.
It would be nice if there were a one size fits all standard but of course that is never going to happen.

Marshall

[Tony-C]

Interesting to see ISO 22000 as a front runner and the GFSI approved FSSC 22000 with no votes.

I would think that will change over the next few years ...... watch this space.

[Simon]

Not exactly conclusive with such a small number of votes, but FSSC 22000's lack of votes is surprising to me also...and I totally agree with you it will become more widely used over the next few years. IMO.

[Madam A. D-tor]

I estimate that, even in the Netherlands, BRC and IFS are bigger then Dutch HACCP option B.

A lot of smaller companies still maintain Dutch HACCP option A, which is not approved by GFSI because there is no comprehensive checklist.

I suppose BRC is still a little bigger then IFS. A lot of companies, which are exporting to both our neighbors Uk and Germany, are maintaining BRC and IFS certificate. Big business for CBs offering combined audits.

[Madam A. D-tor]

In the Netherlands it is expected that the new BRC issue 6, will make organisations to switch to FSCC 22000 or IFS. Depending on the requirements in issue 6 of IFS. Issue 6 of IFS is planned to be released in January 2012. The copies of IFS issue 6, will be free of charge downoadable.

[Charles Chew]

We are recommending initial certification or upgrade to FSSC22000 but we do use some elements under BRC that are clearly functional, value-adding and relevant.

[Charles.C]

In the Netherlands it is expected that the new BRC issue 6, will make organisations to switch to FSCC 22000 or IFS. Depending on the requirements in issue 6 of IFS. Issue 6 of IFS is planned to be released in January 2012. The copies of IFS issue 6, will be free of charge downoadable.

Hi Madam A. D-tor,

Interesting observations.

Is this freedom to choose in yr area primarily related to most local companies having relatively little actual business to UK or pure financial desperation/anger ?

So far, business constraint seems to hv (negatively) forced the choice for many suppliers on this forum, ie UK customers simply refuse to change from BRC, despite GFSI ( overall, the receivers get no cost saving either way because they still perform their own audits anyway !).

One wonders from above comments if BRC are approaching a business "tipping" point within their desire for continuous (self?)"improvement."

Surely "GFSI" must also have a consensus opinion regarding annual-biannual changes within the individual group standards also; after all, it's their status at risk too i think ?

Is the IFS offer of free access simply an admission of lack of penetration outside home base(s) / apparent increasing global market-share of SQF (solely my own forum impression) ?

Again, my impression from viewing this forum seems to be that ISO 22000 / FSSC is utilised/ranked just like the voting in this thread. (but it is a very small, possibly biased, sample of course).

Rgds / Charles.C

[Madam A. D-tor]

Hi Charles,

Retailers in the Netherlands and Belgium are very pragmatic. They require a GFSI approved certificated. So this can be BRC, IFS, Dutch HACCP or FSSC 22000.
Dutch HACCP version 5 (force January 2012) will no longer be a GFSI approved scheme. This is the decision of the owners of this scheme. Back to basic for Dutch HACCP.
Producers in Netherlands/ Belgium supplying to retailers in UK are indeed forced by these retailersto have a BRC certificate. Producers supplying to German retailers are required to have IFS certificate. Producers supplying to both UK and Germany have both certificates (= very nice for CBs = more money!)

Is this freedom to choose in yr area primarily related to most local companies having relatively little actual business to UK or pure financial desperation/anger ?

So, yes, producers which only supply to Dutch or Belgium retailers have the choice for their own.
Also producers in the B2B markt can choose any GFSI approved scheme.

Is the IFS offer of free access simply an admission of lack of penetration outside home base(s) / apparent increasing global market-share of SQF (solely my own forum impression) ?

I do not know the reason. But fees rise and also the costs for the obligated annual training of auditors are higher.

From IFS Food version 6 onwards, IFS will also make the “normative” document, i.e. the actual standard text, available to all users as a free download in various languages on its new website. Also, the fee for uploading the IFS audit reports will be raised from 150 to 200 Euros - the first increase since the start of IFS in 2002

[Philip @ Safefood 360°]

Without any doubt in the UK it has to be the BRC Food Standard. On their website the BRC claim 14,000 companies operating in over 90 countries are Certified to their standards. They were the first and are the biggest pretty much the only FSMS standard for food manufacturers in the UK. I cannot see that changing. It helps to be early. The first edition of the BRC Food Stanadard was published in 1998.

FYI the top ten countries which make up 70% of the 15,294 BRC Food certified sites are;

16% UNITED KINGDOM (2494)
11% ITALY (1675)
7% UNITED STATES (1143)
7% SPAIN (1120)
7% NETHERLANDS (1110)
6% CHINA (931)
5% FRANCE (738)
4% BELGIUM (665)
3% POLAND (451)
3% GERMANY (434)

It seems the BRC may becoming the dominant standard in Italy, Spain and Holland as well. And based on our experience on the ground it is gaining considerable momentum in the US. To put it in perspective the number of BRC certified US sites has increased by 37% over the past 12 months.

[Mark Munro]

I am in the Uk and voted for the BRC. It is probably the second biggest audit we get each year, the biggest being M&S. We are a primary processor of salmon and have audits coming out our ears. A little list:

M&S
BRC
FCI &Label Rouge (comprising about 4 or 5 arranged audits a year plus an unanounce one)
Freedom Foods (animal welfare)
ISO something or other
Some audit to do with Organic foods
SSQF (a salmon qualitty scheme)
Global Gap is in there some place as well
And probably a few others that have slipped my mind.

And I am work towards getting our micro lab up to CLAS accreditation with the extra M&S requirements in it to!!!!!!!!!!

[Charles.C]

Dear Mark Munro,

Rather

Thks for the very illustrative input.

You forget to mention the skeletal work force and even smaller budget.

I thought Global Gap was for vegetables.

I am curious as to the extra micro. requirements for M&S, re-use Petri dishes ?

Rgds / Charles.C

[skredsfan]

Without any doubt in the UK it has to be the BRC Food Standard. On their website the BRC claim 14,000 companies operating in over 90 countries are Certified to their standards. They were the first and are the biggest pretty much the only FSMS standard for food manufacturers in the UK. I cannot see that changing. It helps to be early. The first edition of the BRC Food Stanadard was published in 1998.

It seems that SQF is the popular choice in the US right now. Initially we decided to move forward with SQF Certification, but have since changed directions. We decided to move forward with the FSSC 22000 Certification because it's ISO based. We're already ISO 9001 Certified, so we thought it would be a smoother transition to stay on the same course.

[mesophile]

Hi All,


UK = BRC (obviously, the founders of the standard)

Germany, France, Italy = IFS Food (as the retailers in these countries designed the standard as an alternative to BRC)

Holland/Netherlands = FSSC22000 (designed in the Netherlands, a combination of ISO22000 with added PRP's and some other extras)

USA = SQF (owned by an Amercian organisation - Food Marketing Institiute (FMI) who bought it from the Australians and further developed it)

GlobalGAP = Everywhere really that competes in Livestock/Agricultural/Aquacultural products apart from Canada

CanadaGAP = Massive in Canada, designed by the Canadian Horticulture Council, alernative to GlobalGAP


Thanks,


Simon