Jump to content

  • Quick Navigation
Photo

How to verify and validate a Magnet program?

sqf brc FSSC 22000

  • You cannot start a new topic
  • Please log in to reply
13 replies to this topic

#1 Kellio

Kellio

    Grade - MIFSQN

  • IFSQN Member
  • 156 posts
  • 67 thanks
16
Good

  • Puerto Rico
    Puerto Rico

Posted 01 October 2014 - 04:28 PM

Hello Everyone!!!

 

 

I need some guidance on how to verify and validate a Magnet program. Like in other places, the debate is who is responsible for  maintaining verification and validation of the magnet program? which is part of out foreign material and which is part of our HACCP Plan.

 

The Departments in question are:

 

Maintenance

Quality Assurance and Control

Production

 

Any comments will be greatly appreciated.

 

Have a great week!!!!!! :giggle:

 



#2 michaelgaspard

michaelgaspard

    Grade - AIFSQN

  • IFSQN Associate
  • 35 posts
  • 6 thanks
3
Neutral

  • Mauritius
    Mauritius
  • Gender:Male

Posted 01 October 2014 - 06:52 PM

Hi, you need to do an Standard operational procedure of how to remove the magnet, at what time, how to clean, by whom, and make sure that during magnet removal the metal detector functioning is monitored and recorded closely.

You need to establish a frequency to check externally the Gauss of the magnet and receive a certificate at least yearly. the same person can check and approve for your metal detector yearly,

because you know, the magnet capacity is not the same every year and under every condition.

OF COURSE ALL 3 DEPARTMENTS ARE CONCERNED!! and need to be involved in the sheet and procedure you will do for the established magnet cleaning time interval, signature of representatives from all 3, this reinforce the commitment of everybody in general.

 

kind regards,

Michael G



Thanked by 1 Member:

#3 michaelgaspard

michaelgaspard

    Grade - AIFSQN

  • IFSQN Associate
  • 35 posts
  • 6 thanks
3
Neutral

  • Mauritius
    Mauritius
  • Gender:Male

Posted 01 October 2014 - 06:54 PM

Please no do forget to collect the particles from magnet, weight them and make a graph on a weekly basis for your personal follow up



Thanked by 1 Member:

#4 Kellio

Kellio

    Grade - MIFSQN

  • IFSQN Member
  • 156 posts
  • 67 thanks
16
Good

  • Puerto Rico
    Puerto Rico

Posted 01 October 2014 - 07:24 PM

Thank you Mauritius for your response. It is nice to see other perspectives and remind my self that "Attitude is reflection of leadership"



#5 Charles.C

Charles.C

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Moderator
  • 17,476 posts
  • 4858 thanks
949
Excellent

  • Earth
    Earth
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:SF
    TV
    Movies

Posted 02 October 2014 - 11:47 AM

Dear Kellio,

 

maintaining verification and validation

 

Assuming the haccp plan is primary motivation for yr Va-Ve question - who does the Company  Policy consider is responsible for "maintaining"  it ?, ie where does the buck stop if it fouls up ?

 

Somehow, i doubt it's No.1 or no.3 ?. :smile:

 

Rgds / Charles.C


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


Thanked by 1 Member:

#6 jtocla

jtocla

    Grade - Active

  • IFSQN Active
  • 3 posts
  • 1 thanks
0
Neutral

  • United States
    United States

Posted 02 October 2014 - 05:21 PM

A bit off topic, but where/who do you normally get the certification of the magets?  The manufacture or an outside contractor?  



Thanked by 1 Member:

#7 Dr Vu

Dr Vu

    Grade - MIFSQN

  • IFSQN Member
  • 235 posts
  • 49 thanks
16
Good

  • Canada
    Canada
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Toronto
  • Interests:Action movies...

Posted 03 October 2014 - 12:16 AM

don't forget to check the strength of the magnet at least once annually. They do lose their strength with time and you can trend this (track it) year to year. they do have a recommended strength or a ratio as compared to when you bought it... i can  find out what it is. the test kits are available in the market ( manual pull test and gaussmeter).you can do that inhouse... kit is sold by Eriez  or other companies


A vu in time , saves nine

Thanked by 1 Member:

#8 michaelgaspard

michaelgaspard

    Grade - AIFSQN

  • IFSQN Associate
  • 35 posts
  • 6 thanks
3
Neutral

  • Mauritius
    Mauritius
  • Gender:Male

Posted 03 October 2014 - 06:00 PM

Or contact Goudsmith or Goudsmitt for same,

Kind regards,

Michael G



#9 Kellio

Kellio

    Grade - MIFSQN

  • IFSQN Member
  • 156 posts
  • 67 thanks
16
Good

  • Puerto Rico
    Puerto Rico

Posted 06 October 2014 - 07:49 PM

A bit off topic, but where/who do you normally get the certification of the magets?  The manufacture or an outside contractor?



We have an outside company set up to come and certify the magnets just like we do for our metal detectors. Also, our magnet manufacturer can certify them as well as the equipment to test them.

Arquelio

#10 Kellio

Kellio

    Grade - MIFSQN

  • IFSQN Member
  • 156 posts
  • 67 thanks
16
Good

  • Puerto Rico
    Puerto Rico

Posted 06 October 2014 - 08:01 PM

Dear Kellio,
 
 
Assuming the haccp plan is primary motivation for yr Va-Ve question - who does the Company  Policy consider is responsible for "maintaining"  it ?, ie where does the buck stop if it fouls up ?
 
Somehow, i doubt it's No.1 or no.3 ?. :smile:
 
Rgds / Charles.C


Thank you Charles for your input. Unfortunately, evasion of Accountability is more important than the HACCP Plan to answer your questions. This is driven by a QA Senior Director and QA  Manager where QA does not want to do QA work. I appreciate your wisdom. I makes me feel good that my gut is most of the time right.  However, Food safety should be everybody's concern. :spoton:  :spoton:  :spoton:



#11 Kellio

Kellio

    Grade - MIFSQN

  • IFSQN Member
  • 156 posts
  • 67 thanks
16
Good

  • Puerto Rico
    Puerto Rico

Posted 06 October 2014 - 08:07 PM

don't forget to check the strength of the magnet at least once annually. They do lose their strength with time and you can trend this (track it) year to year. they do have a recommended strength or a ratio as compared to when you bought it... i can  find out what it is. the test kits are available in the market ( manual pull test and gaussmeter).you can do that inhouse... kit is sold by Eriez  or other companies

Thank you for the info. we have the equipment for almost a year and nobody wants to use it. Gaussmeter I thought to be a better fit for us.  Our upcoming Audit will settle this pretty soon.  Thank you for your input.



#12 teaks

teaks

    Grade - MIFSQN

  • IFSQN Member
  • 92 posts
  • 33 thanks
8
Neutral

  • United States
    United States
  • Gender:Female

Posted 26 April 2016 - 02:10 PM

Rather than start a new thread with the same name, I'm trying to hop onto this one to get an answer:

 

We have a liquid trap magnet (not a CCP) in a chocolate line.  We check it once a day, but have never validated it.  I believe it's placement is more for equipment preservation than for food safety (placed after a pump and before a tempering unit). Because we also have in-line filters (which will trap more than metal) both upstream (before the pump) and downstream (after the tempering unit) of this magnet, we have rarely (if ever?) had a finding so I haven't spent too much time thinking about it.

 

I'm trying to figure out how small a piece of metal the magnet can trap.  I don't have the vaguest idea how to translate a pull reading (gauss) to an actual piece of metal in a liquid chocolate stream.  I have two related questions:

1.  How do I figure out how small a piece my magnet can trap in a running situation (validation)?  To do a dry test doesn't strike me as valid.

2. How do I check that regularly to make sure it's working ((verification)?  -- My guess is this can be determined with a pull strength test once I have a baseline.

 

Looking forward to your comments!



#13 Phil_IFS

Phil_IFS

    Grade - Active

  • IFSQN Active
  • 1 posts
  • 0 thanks
0
Neutral

  • United States
    United States

Posted 21 February 2018 - 06:56 PM

 

I'm trying to figure out how small a piece of metal the magnet can trap.  I don't have the vaguest idea how to translate a pull reading (gauss) to an actual piece of metal in a liquid chocolate stream.  I have two related questions:

1.  How do I figure out how small a piece my magnet can trap in a running situation (validation)?  To do a dry test doesn't strike me as valid.

2. How do I check that regularly to make sure it's working ((verification)?  -- My guess is this can be determined with a pull strength test once I have a baseline.

 

Looking forward to your comments!

 

Our company uses magnets only as a CP for incoming bulk or semi-bulk (supersacks) materials. They are all rare-earth magnets, and mostly in-line plate types since most of our materials are dry.

 

I know I'm late to the party with an answer, but felt I could offer a little something.

 

Our practice is to have a magnet manufacturer/distributor come in annually and do the pull tests. Our results are given in pounds, rather than gauss, and we go by an informal requirements of >6 Lb pull strength. This was the number given us by the distributor as "accepted by the food industry", though I am still looking for documentation to that effect (which is what brought me to this site). We clean the magnet after each batch and document findings in QA. 

 

As to your situation, it appears to me that your Food Safety Team (or equivalent group) responsible for your HACCP documents needs to answer some questions:

 

  1. Is It Needed?   I'm not sure it is serving a food safety or food quality purpose. If your group determines the same, then you need to determine whether to remove it to simplify your HACCP.
  2. Is It a CP or CCP?   For this your group will need to do a risk analysis on the unit (it doesn't take long). That should also help with the first question as well.
  3. How Do We Treat It?   If you declared it to be a CP or CCP, then this question is really answered for you. If not so classified, then I would treat it as a strainer. We check strainers once/shift.

 

Good luck.



#14 Charles.C

Charles.C

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Moderator
  • 17,476 posts
  • 4858 thanks
949
Excellent

  • Earth
    Earth
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:SF
    TV
    Movies

Posted 21 February 2018 - 07:36 PM

Our company uses magnets only as a CP for incoming bulk or semi-bulk (supersacks) materials. They are all rare-earth magnets, and mostly in-line plate types since most of our materials are dry.

 

I know I'm late to the party with an answer, but felt I could offer a little something.

 

Our practice is to have a magnet manufacturer/distributor come in annually and do the pull tests. Our results are given in pounds, rather than gauss, and we go by an informal requirements of >6 Lb pull strength. This was the number given us by the distributor as "accepted by the food industry", though I am still looking for documentation to that effect (which is what brought me to this site). We clean the magnet after each batch and document findings in QA. 

 

As to your situation, it appears to me that your Food Safety Team (or equivalent group) responsible for your HACCP documents needs to answer some questions:

 

  1. Is It Needed?   I'm not sure it is serving a food safety or food quality purpose. If your group determines the same, then you need to determine whether to remove it to simplify your HACCP.
  2. Is It a CP or CCP?   For this your group will need to do a risk analysis on the unit (it doesn't take long). That should also help with the first question as well.
  3. How Do We Treat It?   If you declared it to be a CP or CCP, then this question is really answered for you. If not so classified, then I would treat it as a strainer. We check strainers once/shift.

 

Good luck.

 

Hi Phil,

 

Re "red" above, IIRC relevant documentation is referenced/attached in a (probably later) thread. Try searching for "magnet", should not be too many posts to work through and the whole set of matched posts are visible with one click via this page -

 

http://www.ifsqn.com...earch_in=forums


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users