Jump to content

  • Quick Navigation
Photo
- - - - -

Failing SQF -Is this possible? Who is to blame?


  • You cannot start a new topic
  • Please log in to reply
14 replies to this topic

#1 QUALITY22

QUALITY22

    Grade - Active

  • IFSQN Active
  • 23 posts
  • 2 thanks
2
Neutral

  • United States
    United States

Posted 10 April 2017 - 01:27 PM

Recently, I left a company-a manufacturer of Dairy Products to further my career in Quality, Food Safety, and additionally 30% more compensation, which they would not match.

 

During my 2 year tenure- I worked hard 6 days a week 50-55 hour weeks. Never once did a fail or come close to failing an audit. 

 

I passed my SQF level 3 audit (2x) with 94 & 93, (4) Military, (1) FDA inspections, & (3) major customer audits (2 companies are in the top 3 in consumer goods in the world if you know who I am referring too). 

 

The company now has barely passed these audits and failed SQF 2x since my departure. However, through the grape vine- and employees I am friends with- have stated Upper Management believes "that I am the reason for their failure."

 

This makes me very angry as I put 2 hard years working to the success of Food Safety Culture. Not only did I cover all Sanitation, Quality, and Food Safety- I ensured all Maintenance/ Contracted Service departments were in check. I personally perform a a rigorous internal audit, verification, and validation schedule 1.5 months before the audit to ensure all documentation is up-to-date and completed. Its tough-but I have done this for 5 years and never failed me. On top of that-the hired Consultant they used said I had easy auditors lmao, when all but the SQF auditor was the same. 

 

BTW- at my new company I had 4 months to learn all programs, implement programs, and Haccp and passed our first GFSI FSSC 22000 audit with 7 minors- with the good help of my team and staff. Must have been a easy auditor. 

 

Do you feel this is right? Seems like my bridge there is burned from his untrue statements. Or is this just to take blame off of their current staff? They also hired 2 QA Managers since I left (1 fired) and 2 QA supervisors-help I never had. 

 

Simon can you provide some input



#2 Scampi

Scampi

    Fellow

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 2,832 posts
  • 779 thanks
344
Excellent

  • Canada
    Canada
  • Gender:Not Telling

Posted 10 April 2017 - 01:34 PM

I'm certainly not Simon, but here's my take

 

It would appear to me that senior management didn't/doesn't understand the amount of work that it takes to keep a company in compliance. No one would know the program better than you did, and it would stand to reason that they have failed, not because you did anything wrong, but that they did. Senior management hasn't taken the time to comprehend, never mind understand what is involved.

 

The fact that they wouldn't match your salary request also emphasises that they didn't put any value, or not enough value into what you were responsible for.

 

No one likes their name drug through the mud in any fashion........sounds like you're the easy target because you're removed....clearly you made the correct move by leaving

 

As an aside, perhaps put an end to the 6 day work weeks.......you didn't have the help you needed (and i'm sure asked repeatedly for) and as a result instead of letting them fail an audit, you may have shouldered all of the work.....sometimes saying NO is the best/quickest/most necessary action


Because we always have is never an appropriate response!


Thanked by 1 Member:

#3 QAGB

QAGB

    Grade - PIFSQN

  • IFSQN Principal
  • 665 posts
  • 250 thanks
104
Excellent

  • Earth
    Earth

Posted 11 April 2017 - 02:11 PM

Recently, I left a company-a manufacturer of Dairy Products to further my career in Quality, Food Safety, and additionally 30% more compensation, which they would not match.

 

During my 2 year tenure- I worked hard 6 days a week 50-55 hour weeks. Never once did a fail or come close to failing an audit. 

 

I passed my SQF level 3 audit (2x) with 94 & 93, (4) Military, (1) FDA inspections, & (3) major customer audits (2 companies are in the top 3 in consumer goods in the world if you know who I am referring too). 

 

The company now has barely passed these audits and failed SQF 2x since my departure. However, through the grape vine- and employees I am friends with- have stated Upper Management believes "that I am the reason for their failure."

 

This makes me very angry as I put 2 hard years working to the success of Food Safety Culture. Not only did I cover all Sanitation, Quality, and Food Safety- I ensured all Maintenance/ Contracted Service departments were in check. I personally perform a a rigorous internal audit, verification, and validation schedule 1.5 months before the audit to ensure all documentation is up-to-date and completed. Its tough-but I have done this for 5 years and never failed me. On top of that-the hired Consultant they used said I had easy auditors lmao, when all but the SQF auditor was the same. 

 

BTW- at my new company I had 4 months to learn all programs, implement programs, and Haccp and passed our first GFSI FSSC 22000 audit with 7 minors- with the good help of my team and staff. Must have been a easy auditor. 

 

Do you feel this is right? Seems like my bridge there is burned from his untrue statements. Or is this just to take blame off of their current staff? They also hired 2 QA Managers since I left (1 fired) and 2 QA supervisors-help I never had. 

 

Simon can you provide some input

 

 

I'm not Simon either, so I feel odd replying  :ninja:

 

First of all, congrats to you Quality22 for making the move. It sounds like you were way overworked and understaffed. 

 

I understand the struggle to some extent. We have come a long way since going after GFSI several years ago. We've done very well audit wise, thanks to a great group of QA people and some dedicated employees. However, once you start doing very well, it becomes expected; even if situations and commitment levels from other groups change. They don't think of it as an accomplishment to have someone of your level that can get the QA portion of the company fine tuned; they think it's just something that must be very easy to do because you're doing it so well all the time. It feels sort of like this: "Oh we passed the GFSI audit with less than three minors? MMkay. What's on the production schedule for tomorrow?"

 

If I were you, I'd be very angry too because it's not an easy task to get effective procedures implemented and satisfy auditors of all types. The comments sound petty and fairly inaccurate to me. It sounds like you wore a lot of hats, and other people didn't bother to learn from you while they had you there. Once you left, you took the hats (so to speak) with you, and now they are upset because they are having to rebuild. Obviously, you did a great job if your audits were all in great standing; so it doesn't make sense that it's your fault. If they had given you help, or someone actually had been cross-trained, they probably wouldn't be in this position.

 

As far as the blame, it's got a lot to do with them kicking themselves for not being more involved in the work so that they could have had a better transition phase. However, it sounds to me like you have a great job now. Whether or not any bridges were burnt at the past company, keep up the good work where you are now, and build your references from there.

 

QAGB



#4 QUALITY22

QUALITY22

    Grade - Active

  • IFSQN Active
  • 23 posts
  • 2 thanks
2
Neutral

  • United States
    United States

Posted 11 April 2017 - 04:05 PM

Thanks for the input. Makes me feel better.

Just found out that they are switching to BRC because its easier. They are running away from the issues and turning to another source. Watch out for recalls 😲



#5 sqf girl

sqf girl

    Grade - Active

  • IFSQN Active
  • 9 posts
  • 3 thanks
0
Neutral

  • United States
    United States

Posted 11 April 2017 - 07:45 PM

I am also not Simon.  I am not sure I have an answer to question, but more of a statement.  I think all of us in this field have often wondered what it would be like without the people who were on the Food Safety Team from the beginning.  The pillars who built the plans from the ground up are often under appreciated.  Within my own company and even from the President, it has been said that know one knows what it is that I do.  Ha!  I think you just answered a question that many have been quietly thinking to ourselves.  I am quite certain that once your former company becomes involved enough and sees how many people it takes to run the show in your absence, they will begin to appreciate you as a former asset to the company.  The excuse that it was your fault, only holds true for a short time.  After which, it becomes someone else who must take the blame.  You cannot have a failing program for years on end and blame you.  They will get it.  Slowly, but they will.  Do not worry about the past and things you cannot change.  If the company is the type of company whose mantra is to blame people for others shortcomings, then "good riddance".



#6 SQFconsultant

SQFconsultant

    SQFconsultant

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 3,090 posts
  • 788 thanks
652
Excellent

  • United States
    United States
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:Truth is like a delicious slice of watermelon... you just want more and more!

Posted 11 April 2017 - 08:25 PM

That's funny... they are switching to BRC because they think it is easier.

Oh my goodness, they have another think coming.

Their failure was not your fault.... they own it all.

Let it go move on to better things, of course you already have.


Kind regards,

 

Glenn Oster
 
GOC GROUP / +1.772.646.4115 / Food - Food Packaging - Food Storage/DC

SQF, BRC & IFS System Development, Implementation & Certification Consultants

Serving Small-to-Mid-Size Businesses | Now accepting: BTC, XRP, ETH, DAI, USDCoin & LTC

Internal Auditor Training | eConsultant | FSVP | United States - Panama - Costa Rica

http://www.GlennOsterConsulting.com  -- 

 

 

Red October? Possibly - more like Green

Get the GOC C-CUR Guide (PDF)

https://bit.ly/36hW9Z2

 

 

 

 

 

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Thanked by 2 Members:

#7 Simon

Simon

    IFSQN...it's My Life

  • IFSQN Admin
  • 12,291 posts
  • 1294 thanks
593
Excellent

  • United Kingdom
    United Kingdom
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester
  • Interests:Married to Michelle, Father of three boys (Oliver, Jacob and Louis). I enjoy cycling, walking and travelling, watching sport, especially football and Manchester United. Oh and I love food and beer and wine.

Posted 13 April 2017 - 03:24 PM

I'm Spartacus Simon.

 

In my experience when an employee leaves they are good for a blame hound (scapegoat) for at least 6 month's.  

 

Don't look back look forward.

 

Cheers,

Simon


hand-pointing-down.gif
 
Get FREE bitesize education with IFSQN webinar recordings.
 
Download this handy excel for desktop access to over 140 Food Safety Friday's webinar recordings.
https://www.ifsqn.com/fsf/Free%20Food%20Safety%20Videos.xlsx

 
Check out IFSQN’s extensive library of FREE food safety videos
https://www.ifsqn.com/food_safety_videos.html

 

recommend-us-on-facebook.png


#8 Jim E.

Jim E.

    Grade - MIFSQN

  • IFSQN Member
  • 127 posts
  • 18 thanks
8
Neutral

  • Canada
    Canada
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Alberta, Canada
  • Interests:Sports of course.
    Food safety for all things eaten not just what we make.
    Being able to see my kids grow up in healthy environment.

Posted 13 April 2017 - 05:06 PM

      I too am not Simon.  But I would take this as a sign of the hard work and effort to put into that plants food safety program.  I am not sure about SQF but BRC is no easy route to take, so good luck to them. 

 

     Jim



#9 RMAV

RMAV

    Grade - SIFSQN

  • IFSQN Senior
  • 406 posts
  • 121 thanks
41
Excellent

  • United States
    United States
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:USA - Midwest
  • Interests:QA, Micro, Sanitation;
    Meats, Juice, Condiments;
    SQF, Audit, and aviation

Posted 13 April 2017 - 05:50 PM

I'm not Simon either.  It appears you provided a level of service to the company to which they became accustomed and subsequently took for granted.  Now that you're gone, there's a hole that they weren't prepared to fill.  It further appears they did not provide the proper support as their SQF survival should never hinge on one person.  Heck, if the POTUS is replaceable, all of us should be!  Hopefully the rumor is not true that they stoop to such unprofessional levels as to blame you. 

 

Another side to change in personnel (in general, not your situation, QUALITY22) is when we take over for a predecessor, we bring a fresh perspective and usually find things not done that should have been.  We should judge such situations very carefully and not necessarily take for face value what they did vs what they should have done.



#10 mzenas

mzenas

    Grade - AIFSQN

  • IFSQN Associate
  • 28 posts
  • 4 thanks
0
Neutral

  • United States
    United States

Posted 13 April 2017 - 06:57 PM

I'm not a Simon either...and I don't even play one on TV.  The promised land for people like us is for everyone in an organization to embrace the respective system, whether it is ISO, BRC, SQF, etc.  You really cannot have a "true" system in place, and operating as intended, if everyone is not doing their part. 

 

But...reality bites.



#11 Charles.C

Charles.C

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Moderator
  • 17,393 posts
  • 4841 thanks
944
Excellent

  • Earth
    Earth
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:SF
    TV
    Movies

Posted 13 April 2017 - 08:00 PM

I'm not a Simon either...and I don't even play one on TV.  The promised land for people like us is for everyone in an organization to embrace the respective system, whether it is ISO, BRC, SQF, etc.  You really cannot have a "true" system in place, and operating as intended, if everyone is not doing their part. 

 

But...reality bites.

 

Yes, and it usually bites QA. Guaranteed expendable.


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


#12 CTucci

CTucci

    Grade - Active

  • IFSQN Active
  • 11 posts
  • 0 thanks
0
Neutral

  • United States
    United States

Posted 17 April 2017 - 04:23 PM

Like many others, I am not Simon either, but experienced a similar situation in a previous situation.  When I quit, it took 3 months and 6 employees to replace me. No, I'm not that great, but, there were things that could have enticed me to stay longer; however it wasn't an additioinal increase in salary and an extrra week vacation - because at the end of the day, the same folks were doing the same things.  I still said no, and left.  

 

In all reality, it is hard to find a group to work for who is like all of the individuals who responded to this message, but... if we could form a company and do things the GFSI audit directed way and make sure it was right the first time, look how much easier it would be.  I'd work with any of you any day.

 

Please keep up the good work and keep spreading the good information around in the plant(s).  Build a team and make sure management is involved in that team, then there will be more success everywhere.

 

Keep at it, you are doing well!



#13 redfox

redfox

    Grade - SIFSQN

  • IFSQN Senior
  • 481 posts
  • 155 thanks
21
Excellent

  • Philippines
    Philippines

Posted 18 April 2017 - 07:26 AM

Hello quality22,

 

It is really easy to point fingers to those who were absent. You were not there when they "spoiled the broth". You don't have to feel any guilt at all. It is just a simple blame game.

 

They are your past...time to let go.

 

regards,

redfox



#14 GMO

GMO

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 2,696 posts
  • 686 thanks
176
Excellent

  • United Kingdom
    United Kingdom

Posted 18 April 2017 - 11:38 AM

Recently, I left a company-a manufacturer of Dairy Products to further my career in Quality, Food Safety, and additionally 30% more compensation, which they would not match.

 

During my 2 year tenure- I worked hard 6 days a week 50-55 hour weeks. Never once did a fail or come close to failing an audit. 

 

I passed my SQF level 3 audit (2x) with 94 & 93, (4) Military, (1) FDA inspections, & (3) major customer audits (2 companies are in the top 3 in consumer goods in the world if you know who I am referring too). 

 

The company now has barely passed these audits and failed SQF 2x since my departure. However, through the grape vine- and employees I am friends with- have stated Upper Management believes "that I am the reason for their failure."

 

This makes me very angry as I put 2 hard years working to the success of Food Safety Culture. Not only did I cover all Sanitation, Quality, and Food Safety- I ensured all Maintenance/ Contracted Service departments were in check. I personally perform a a rigorous internal audit, verification, and validation schedule 1.5 months before the audit to ensure all documentation is up-to-date and completed. Its tough-but I have done this for 5 years and never failed me. On top of that-the hired Consultant they used said I had easy auditors lmao, when all but the SQF auditor was the same. 

 

BTW- at my new company I had 4 months to learn all programs, implement programs, and Haccp and passed our first GFSI FSSC 22000 audit with 7 minors- with the good help of my team and staff. Must have been a easy auditor. 

 

Do you feel this is right? Seems like my bridge there is burned from his untrue statements. Or is this just to take blame off of their current staff? They also hired 2 QA Managers since I left (1 fired) and 2 QA supervisors-help I never had. 

 

Simon can you provide some input

 

Two things I'd say; one is let your success speak for itself.  There is no point trying to challenge this belief which you've only heard from unofficial routes anyway.  You don't know how accurate that the leaders of this company have this attitude and you don't know who put that idea in their minds if it is accurate.

 

Secondly, I would say learn from the experience.  As you move up in an organisation, you learn lots of lessons but one is that the food safety culture you create should persist after you have left.  I appreciate you were a relatively junior employee in your last role and didn't appear to have buy in from the leadership team but the really top class QA Managers still influence upwards, sideways, downwards and even months or years after their departure.  This is no criticism of you as the root cause and the responsibility for the issues this site subsequently faced is on the management team but if you want to direct a Technical function some day, how could you have influenced those around you so your impact persisted?  A good question to ponder on and make yourself even more successful in the future. 

 

The reason I say this is I remember years ago leaving a site then finding out their micro standards fell through the floor.  When I looked back at the graphs I could even see the impact of holidays, when I was off for two weeks, micro results got worse.  My first response was to feel great, my impact was clearly measurable.  My second thought though was "oh heck, no-one else believes in this apart from me."  Since then I've spent far more time focusing on people, behaviours and trying to bring everyone with me rather than the more (if I'm honest) QC approach I had before.  It has really shown benefits.   You are not me though and your situation may have been different but I thought I'd give you this food for thought.

 

Don't get mad, be so wrapped up in your own success and self improvement it barely registers.



Thanked by 1 Member:

#15 QUALITY22

QUALITY22

    Grade - Active

  • IFSQN Active
  • 23 posts
  • 2 thanks
2
Neutral

  • United States
    United States

Posted 18 April 2017 - 12:19 PM

I appreciate all the feedback. I must say it's encouraging. I love food safety and quality, and I love my new current position.

I am constantly trying to improve myself and the fms-at any organizatiob.

My next chapter will be to pursue lean manufacturing courses.






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

EV SSL Certificate