Jump to content

  • Quick Navigation
Photo

Can an auditor question a CCP?

Share this

  • You cannot start a new topic
  • Please log in to reply
8 replies to this topic

faizal

    Grade - Active

  • IFSQN Active
  • 5 posts
  • 0 thanks
0
Neutral

  • Mauritius
    Mauritius
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Mauritius

Posted 21 August 2020 - 11:47 AM

Hi everybody.

 

Can an auditor question a CCP, when all the workings have been well elaborated and defined. Thanks to comment. Regards

 



olenazh

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 1,364 posts
  • 441 thanks
434
Excellent

  • Canada
    Canada
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Toronto
  • Interests:My job, church, reading, gym, horror movies

Posted 21 August 2020 - 11:56 AM

We've never experienced that: no auditor or government inspector ever questioned our CCPs - though, it really depends on an auditor... 



SQFconsultant

    SQFconsultant

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 4,734 posts
  • 1151 thanks
1,156
Excellent

  • United States
    United States
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:Just when I thought I was out - They pulled me back in!!!

Posted 21 August 2020 - 12:53 PM

Yes, an Auditor can question it -- an Auditor can question anything they want to.


All the Best,

 

All Rights Reserved,

Without Prejudice,

Glenn Oster.

Glenn Oster Consulting, LLC -

SQF System Development, Implementation & Certification | eConsultant | Internal Auditor Training

http://www.GCEMVI.XYZ

https://glennoster.website3.me/

 


JJMartin

    Grade - Active

  • IFSQN Active
  • 9 posts
  • 2 thanks
2
Neutral

  • United States
    United States

Posted 21 August 2020 - 12:58 PM

Hi everybody.

 

Can an auditor question a CCP, when all the workings have been well elaborated and defined. Thanks to comment. Regards

 

What exactly did they ask about the CCP?



MDaleDDF

    Grade - PIFSQN

  • IFSQN Principal
  • 569 posts
  • 217 thanks
433
Excellent

  • United States
    United States
  • Gender:Male

Posted 21 August 2020 - 01:39 PM

I agree an auditor can question whatever they want.  It's the largest weakness in the validity of these systems imho.  There's one certain I've done for 12 years to the satisfaction of every auditor I've ever had, then last year the auditor dings me on it.  It wasn't a huge thing, but still, how can it be ok for 11 auditors, and worth writing me up for a 12th?   I jumped through the hoop, but I disagreed quite a lot.  There should be more continuity in their judgement.

It would definitely be interesting to hear more about the circumstances of the ccp.  What you make, the ccp, auditor issue, etc...



The Food Scientist

    Grade - FIFSQN

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 1,057 posts
  • 268 thanks
209
Excellent

  • United States
    United States
  • Gender:Female
  • Interests:Food Science, Nature, SQF, Learning, Trying out new foods, Sarcasm.

Posted 21 August 2020 - 01:51 PM

If there is something to be questioned, then why not? 

 

:)


Everything in food is science. The only subjective part is when you eat it. - Alton Brown.


TimG

    Grade - PIFSQN

  • IFSQN Principal
  • 649 posts
  • 191 thanks
322
Excellent

  • United States
    United States

Posted 21 August 2020 - 04:53 PM

First, I mainly came here to ask: Wow, is Mauritius as gorgeous as the pictures that come up in a google search? Are you guys hiring??

 

Second, please keep in mind that in most instances, simply questioning the validity of your CCP (or HACCP plan in general) is kind of par for the course. What type of auditor is it? Are they attempting to have you change something about the CCP? If so, you would have to have an internal meeting with the food safety team (HACCP team) to determine if the change is beneficial, or if it would impose a risk. If they are questioning the CCP out of a true concern, don't take offense. Part of our jobs is continuous improvement, if they suggest an improvement, don't ignore it out of spite.



SQFconsultant

    SQFconsultant

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 4,734 posts
  • 1151 thanks
1,156
Excellent

  • United States
    United States
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:Just when I thought I was out - They pulled me back in!!!

Posted 21 August 2020 - 05:07 PM

Someone mentioned about having a bunch of auditors pass them on something and then another one comes in and gigs them on the same thing.

 

Always a possibility that the previous group of auditors were wrong and new guy was right!

 

I worked for a hotel franchise company years ago and we had a very strict franchise compliance department, when someone signed the franchise agreement they were also signing the QA compliance agreement too.

 

After several years as a QA Inspector I moved into the role of what was pretty much "Internal Affairs"  and in that role I had to follow-up on the other Inspectors.

 

We did inspections every 6 months.

 

We had a franchised hotel over in Houma, LA where there had been seven or so previous inspections and each one resulted in a passing grade.

 

Was checking guest complaints one day and noticed a lot of complaints for this one.

 

Talked to the VP and he said, that look tells me you want to go.

 

So, I get over to Houma and we do the inspection - it's bad, really bad - all sorts of bad and that is not recent bad stuff, it appears to have been there for a while.

 

They fail - I go in to the do the out briefing and the owner wants to lock the door behind me (this is never allowed to happen), I block it and tell him to sit down - he does, but then reaches under his desk and as I am delivering the news he's telling me that he wanted to introduce me to something that he showed to all the other inspectors.

 

Sawed off shotgun.

 

All the others passed him with flying colors, because he threatened to blow their heads off and he wanted to let me know that I needed to change the score.

 

I said OK, but didn't change the score and got out of there real fast.

 

I called it in once I was up the road a ways.

 

That's the extreme of course, but lots of things can happen for everybody else to do the same and then one comes in and does the opposite.


All the Best,

 

All Rights Reserved,

Without Prejudice,

Glenn Oster.

Glenn Oster Consulting, LLC -

SQF System Development, Implementation & Certification | eConsultant | Internal Auditor Training

http://www.GCEMVI.XYZ

https://glennoster.website3.me/

 


SQFconsultant

    SQFconsultant

  • IFSQN Fellow
  • 4,734 posts
  • 1151 thanks
1,156
Excellent

  • United States
    United States
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:Just when I thought I was out - They pulled me back in!!!

Posted 21 August 2020 - 05:20 PM

First, I mainly came here to ask: Wow, is Mauritius as gorgeous as the pictures that come up in a google search? Are you guys hiring??

 

Second, please keep in mind that in most instances, simply questioning the validity of your CCP (or HACCP plan in general) is kind of par for the course. What type of auditor is it? Are they attempting to have you change something about the CCP? If so, you would have to have an internal meeting with the food safety team (HACCP team) to determine if the change is beneficial, or if it would impose a risk. If they are questioning the CCP out of a true concern, don't take offense. Part of our jobs is continuous improvement, if they suggest an improvement, don't ignore it out of spite.

 

Answering the part about Mauritius --- I almost got an SQF development on Madagascar but they decided to not go the GFSI route (dang) and if I had traveled there I also wanted to head over to Mauritius as well - it is beautiful!!!


All the Best,

 

All Rights Reserved,

Without Prejudice,

Glenn Oster.

Glenn Oster Consulting, LLC -

SQF System Development, Implementation & Certification | eConsultant | Internal Auditor Training

http://www.GCEMVI.XYZ

https://glennoster.website3.me/

 




Share this

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users