6 replies to this topic

[egonwie79]

Hi All,

Quick question!

 

If a huge quantity of frozen desert doesn't meet your micro standards for indicator bacteria like ACC and coliforms but is negative for all pathogens( ecoli , listeria, salmonella) will you dispose? or there are some criteria's you will use to determine disposition?

[olenazh]

If your frozen dessert is not FROZEN DAIRY DESSERT, which is standardized product, there is no regulatory requirement to the bacteria level in unstandardized products. However, it is your responsibility as a food manufacturer to ensure your product is safe for human consumption. You should establish minimum levels for micro in your products and stick to them. One of my customers is ice cream/frozen dessert manufacturer, so I'm a bit experienced in that. My advise: I wouldn't test products for ACC as it's always showing high counts, and secondly it's a waste of money as you never know what particular bacteria it shows. RE: should you release your frozen dessert having high count of Coliform? No, I wouldn't take a chance

[Dr.Des]

If you have a target to meet and you don't meet it, your product has failed so you must reject it.
Otherwise your targets are incorrect and need to be reviewed. What was the science or rationale about setting the specs where they are?Who set them? Are they actually valid for your product?
ACC is not a food safety criterion, but indicators like coliforms, E.coli, enterobacteriaceae are. Their presence may indicate fecal contamination. Fecal contamination may include pathogens.

Is this a chance you can take? Your risk assessments need to be done/reviewed to help you make decisions like the one you are facing now.

[Charles.C]

Hi All,

Quick question!

 

If a huge quantity of frozen desert doesn't meet your micro standards for indicator bacteria like ACC and coliforms but is negative for all pathogens( ecoli , listeria, salmonella) will you dispose? or there are some criteria's you will use to determine disposition?

 

Quick answer !

 

Regulatory requirements ?

Contractual requirements ?

Standard = ?

Data = ?

 

@ Dr Des - afaik haccp does not consider coliforms, generic E.coli, Enterobacteriaceae as specifically safety related. But I agree that astronomic values would be a cause for "alarm". And perhaps even less than astronomic if sufficiently "abnormal".

[egonwie79]

If you have a target to meet and you don't meet it, your product has failed so you must reject it.
Otherwise your targets are incorrect and need to be reviewed. What was the science or rationale about setting the specs where they are?Who set them? Are they actually valid for your product?
ACC is not a food safety criterion, but indicators like coliforms, E.coli, enterobacteriaceae are. Their presence may indicate fecal contamination. Fecal contamination may include pathogens.

Is this a chance you can take? Your risk assessments need to be done/reviewed to help you make decisions like the one you are facing now.

Thanks for this insight. I really do appreciate it.

[egonwie79]

Quick answer !

 

Regulatory requirements ?

Contractual requirements ?

Standard = ?

Data = ?

 

@ Dr Des - afaik haccp does not consider coliforms, generic E.coli, Enterobacteriaceae as specifically safety related. But I agree that astronomic values would be a cause for "alarm". And perhaps even less than astronomic if sufficiently "abnormal".

Thank you.

[Charles.C]

Thank you.

 

So what was the data like ?