13 replies to this topic

[jocelyn.castano]

Hi everybody,

 

I recently started working in a meat processing facility and we are currently working on our annual HACCP plan reassessment.

 

At the moment there's only one HACCP plan in the Raw Ground product process category since, at first, they only produced frozen patties. At some point they added another production line for fresh ground beef bricks, and they made very few changes in the HACCP Plan and Flow Chart. We use the same raw materials, ingredients and machinery for grinding all products, but then, part of that ground beef is used for frozen patties and the other for fresh ground beef bricks in different machinery and production lines. 

 

Would we need two different HACCP Plans and Flow Charts for frozen and fresh product? Or can we still use the same we have here now?

[olenazh]

Hi Jocelyn, welcome to the forum. I think, you should have 2 different HACCP plans: one for ground beef, and another - for patties to avoid confusions, particularly as you're using different equipment. Your flow chart should demonstrate the whole process, from the beginning to the end, including parameters, quality checks, CCPs, etc. 

[Scampi]

I disagree with Olenzah

1 would have 1 HACCP plan with diverging flow charts

 

The equipment IMHO does not dictate the number of plans.  Since both are raw and I'm assuming share allergens AND storage AND shipping docks, 1 HACCP plan GROUND MEAT PATTIES split into fresh and frozen

[Setanta]

I am not going to be taking sides :) but my first instinct was to think your process is the same.

This is my simplistic version
Receiving
Storage
Machine process through to patties
Machine process through to loaves
CCP
Packaging
Out the Door

Edited by Setanta, 01 November 2022 - 04:55 PM.

[RyH]

Personally I'd expand your current HACCP plan since the early stages are the same, it's your choice though.
One HACCP means less admin when it comes to reviews.
 

[Scotty_SQF]

You do not need two different HACCP Plans.  It can be one with diverging flow charts assuming the process and risks are the same for both.

[Charles.C]

Hi everybody,

 

I recently started working in a meat processing facility and we are currently working on our annual HACCP plan reassessment.

 

At the moment there's only one HACCP plan in the Raw Ground product process category since, at first, they only produced frozen patties. At some point they added another production line for fresh ground beef bricks, and they made very few changes in the HACCP Plan and Flow Chart. We use the same raw materials, ingredients and machinery for grinding all products, but then, part of that ground beef is used for frozen patties and the other for fresh ground beef bricks in different machinery and production lines. 

 

Would we need two different HACCP Plans and Flow Charts for frozen and fresh product? Or can we still use the same we have here now?

Hi jocelyn,

 

It likely comes down to whether it is practically feasible to demonstrate "equivalent" risks exist for the non-shared production portions, eg different equipment. If not then the overall hazard analysis may get too confused and become difficult to follow.

 

See this post/thread -
https://www.ifsqn.co...an/#entry189458

(and also Post 17)

[FSQA]

Shouldn't temperature requirements be different Frozen vs Fresh in the hazard analysis?

[whateva]

If it's two different lines, you'll need 2 different HACCP plans. I'm assuming the equipment will be different, therefore the hazards will be different.

 

Just my thoughs, hope this helps.

 

 

Hi everybody,

 

I recently started working in a meat processing facility and we are currently working on our annual HACCP plan reassessment.

 

At the moment there's only one HACCP plan in the Raw Ground product process category since, at first, they only produced frozen patties. At some point they added another production line for fresh ground beef bricks, and they made very few changes in the HACCP Plan and Flow Chart. We use the same raw materials, ingredients and machinery for grinding all products, but then, part of that ground beef is used for frozen patties and the other for fresh ground beef bricks in different machinery and production lines. 

 

Would we need two different HACCP Plans and Flow Charts for frozen and fresh product? Or can we still use the same we have here now?

[Scampi]

If it's two different lines, you'll need 2 different HACCP plans. I'm assuming the equipment will be different, therefore the hazards will be different.

 

Just my thoughs, hope this helps.

 

As you can see, there are varying opinions on how to handle this.  I was in poultry slaughter, 1 HACCP plan from live receiving to deboning even though a machine deboned thighs and breast was deboned by hand

[whateva]

Very interesting. Both deboning process was in a temperature controlled room? Oh...the layering of clothing begins. Was in beef slaughter myself. Justified and controlled, need to explain your decision on why just the 1 HACCP or switch to 2. One may say it complicates, another may say it simplifies. 

 

As you can see, there are varying opinions on how to handle this.  I was in poultry slaughter, 1 HACCP plan from live receiving to deboning even though a machine deboned thighs and breast was deboned by hand

[Scampi]

Very interesting. Both deboning process was in a temperature controlled room? Oh...the layering of clothing begins. Was in beef slaughter myself. Justified and controlled, need to explain your decision on why just the 1 HACCP or switch to 2. One may say it complicates, another may say it simplifies. 

I don't miss needing freezer boots and long johns to go to work that's for sure!  After evis, the entire plant was kept around 4C!

[whateva]

Yep, that sounds about right :)

I don't miss needing freezer boots and long johns to go to work that's for sure!  After evis, the entire plant was kept around 4C!

[jfrey123]

I think you're fine having a divergent HACCP plan, so long as all steps listed end up properly filled out in your hazard analysis.

 

I'm curious as to whether the same input material can end up going down either path.  I.e., is it possible for you to be halfway through one input lot of beef making them into frozen patties and after completing that order, switch over and start making the fresh bricks?

 

If that's the case, then I double my support for a single HACCP plan.  I'm hypothesizing that the process doesn't diverge until after you've ground your beef, at which point you're either shaping it into bricks for fresh packaging or shaping into patties to frozen packaging.  When all of the input material starts off in the same process, and same equipment up to divergence, you're only left with a couple of extra steps and repeating the HACCP plan a second time to say mostly the same thing feels cumbersome.  Unless your HA reveals specific reasons why the fresh process is extraordinarily more hazardous than the frozen process, I think it's fine to list on one.