32 replies to this topic

[GMO]

I'm in my third decade working in the food industry in the UK and I'm spent.  I recently handed in my notice at my job because I could see into the future....

 

Am I a clairvoyant?  No, just bitterly tired.  Our business is becoming vastly more complicated (gone are the days of "dedicated" factories) and it's reached a crunch point.  I knew before I even asked what the answer would be. 

 

No more resource for Technical.

It all comes down to money.  

 

Please tell me this isn't everywhere?  I need some hope...

[Setanta]

I get it and I am so sorry!

 

I don't know if there will need to be a "Serious Event" to make facilities wake up, but it seems like QA/Food Safety is getting the squeeze again. After 3 decades, you sound like you're closer to retirement, stick it out if you can. But maybe at a facility that is less stressful.

 

I'm eager to hear what others will say...

[GMO]

I'm only just in my third decade so sadly not close enough to retirement.  But I almost posted the same as you... I see another horsegate or peanut butter corporation of America in our future or similar.

The problem is even if you do get the guys with the cash to sign on the line, the resource out there is... going to say this carefully.  Patchy.  I'm not sure if our talent team are just crap at recruiting or if that many of the experienced team members have retired?  But in the UK at least, auditors are now being recruited with barely any life experience for rubbish pay.  You could pull the wool over their eyes if you see fit or get stupid major non conformances completely unrelated to risk.  Decent Technical and Process people are like hen's teeth.  Young people are jacking it in and who can blame them?  Long working hours for normally utter disrespect and disinterest from the people who run the businesses.  And after all this, the base operator wage goes up and up as the stress ramps up on Technical people with limited pay progression.

Then you have to sit with retailers with their prepubescent buyers throwing their weight around demanding X and Y with no thought on the consequences.  GSCOP is a joke.  If you end up there you've killed the relationship anyway.

[MMQA]

I have only been in food safety for about a decade and have said F it a couple times. I have been at my current job for less than a year and already feel like I am drowning in a glass of water. The issues are beyond my control and a lot of $$$ is needed (structural, maintenance, building issues). My experience is that there is this big push and immense amount of pressure to make the production, with food safety being dragged through the dirt and ignored. Any time I bring something up, it seems like I am getting word salad just to appease me. I would love to think it isn't like this everywhere else but I doubt it..

[G M]

Safety First

Second

Third!

 

Saw that on a shirt, meant for personnel safety, but the message is generally the same for food.

[MDaleDDF]

Well I don't know if this will make yall feel better or worse, but my owner is great!   Lol.  Money if requested for anything around my lab, has never once been denied.   I have a small team of idiotic, but good hearted employees who are constantly trying to do better (most anyways.   my temps are useless, but that's ok, they don't touch anything important).   We're constantly investing in new equipment upgrades, building expansions and upgrades, and I'm told we're going to build a huge brand new building within the next 10 years!

So nope, not everyone is feeling it.   Our first job in my place is food safety.   Food going out the door is secondary.  Safety is job one.  

 

I guess I'm lucky?!

[jufragasa]

Last week our process manager met with the quality department and told us to forget about salary increases.
I've been working in the food industry for 5 years and I'm becoming more and more disappointed with leadership.
In another meeting, the manager said that he would not be in charge of the quality objectives, the only thing that interests him at this moment is to produce and reduce costs, the profit margins, if there are any, are becoming less and less, because the market is not paying a fair price for our products, he said.

[Miss Frankie]

Unfortunately, it's not just the food industry. It's everywhere.  
My husband is a machinist and works in a facility that makes airplane parts (not Boeing).  He's been in the trade for 40+ years and knows his stuff. But because he doesn't have the right college degree, he can't advance in his company. But they are hiring fresh out of college kids for management positions. They don't have a clue what he does, or even how to turn on one of his machines, yet they are his 'boss' and start out making a lot more money than him.  He's the one making the parts to make the company money, but can't get the tools he needs to do his job right.
 

[kfromNE]

Miss Frankie, funny enough - the company I work for doesn't care a lot about degrees. They take pride in employees starting at the bottom and rising to the management level/corporate level. Also sticking with the company for years. Now, they may give one of those people a management position over a department they have no experience in though. 

 

My job is stressful with all the SKUs and different processes but I am backed and supported by my boss. 

For our facility - Employee safety comes first followed by food safety then quality. My boss does live by this. Our other facilities - I know that isn't always the case. I've also worked other places where this wasn't true. 

 

GMO - some companies/bosses do care. They are a dime a dozen. In the USA - USDA inspectors (meat inspectors) have horrible hours but their benefits are really good. FDA - better hours but not as many perks. With your experience - maybe something to consider in the UK. 

Edited by kfromNE, 20 March 2024 - 06:48 PM.

[ChristinaK]

I'm sorry you're experiencing this, GMO.

 

I don't have much else to add because it seems like everyone else has already said what I'm thinking (my meds and coffee haven't kicked in yet either, ha).

[MDaleDDF]

If u got meds, you gotta share with the class......

[SoupsNStuff]

It's funny/depressing attending all these QA webinars and the speakers are from these big publicly traded companies with lots of financial and personnel support. Inevitably the Q&A will include questions like "What if our company doesn't have a good food safety culture and upper management doesn't care?" and the speaker's answer is "Hmm...That's tough. Luckily, everyone at -company name- is really dedicated :) You just have to tell management how important it is :)"

 

I'd love to see a webinar called "How to Cope with Bad Food Safety Culture When You Can't Leave Your Job Because the Companies That Have a Good Culture Currently Aren't Hiring Or They Are In Nebraska and No Offense But I Don't Want to Move to Nebraska"  

[kfromNE]

It's funny/depressing attending all these QA webinars and the speakers are from these big publicly traded companies with lots of financial and personnel support. Inevitably the Q&A will include questions like "What if our company doesn't have a good food safety culture and upper management doesn't care?" and the speaker's answer is "Hmm...That's tough. Luckily, everyone at -company name- is really dedicated :) You just have to tell management how important it is :)"

 

I'd love to see a webinar called "How to Cope with Bad Food Safety Culture When You Can't Leave Your Job Because the Companies That Have a Good Culture Currently Aren't Hiring Or They Are In Nebraska and No Offense But I Don't Want to Move to Nebraska"  

 

     

[Scampi]

1000 times this!   

It's funny/depressing attending all these QA webinars and the speakers are from these big publicly traded companies with lots of financial and personnel support. Inevitably the Q&A will include questions like "What if our company doesn't have a good food safety culture and upper management doesn't care?" and the speaker's answer is "Hmm...That's tough. Luckily, everyone at -company name- is really dedicated :) You just have to tell management how important it is :)"

 

I'd love to see a webinar called "How to Cope with Bad Food Safety Culture When You Can't Leave Your Job Because the Companies That Have a Good Culture Currently Aren't Hiring Or They Are In Nebraska and No Offense But I Don't Want to Move to Nebraska"  

[Scampi]

I am going to pi** some people of here i'm sure but what the hedoublehockeysticks

 

A) Millennials at work are a HUGE problem, the first generation of participation awards and not being held back at school   work ethic begins when kiddos are young

 

B) the global economy is a mess  and a large contributing factor to companies pinching ridiculous pennies to try and stay afloat

 

C) Amazon, Wal Mart and Costco are killers to lots of good business'

 

D) Canada specific--a lack of a grocery code of conduct, the fees they charge should be illegal

 

 

I agree about another PCA tragedy     the masterful GFSI scheme forgot that one cannot police themselves, asking would be auditors to essentially work for free in the beginning is never going to draw the best and brightest, and when my business is tied to the 15k I pay for the privilege of a "knowledgeable" and "objective" auditor, the system is designed to fail

[kfromNE]

I am going to pi** some people of here i'm sure but what the hedoublehockeysticks

 

A) Millennials at work are a HUGE problem, the first generation of participation awards and not being held back at school   work ethic begins when kiddos are young

 

B) the global economy is a mess  and a large contributing factor to companies pinching ridiculous pennies to try and stay afloat

 

C) Amazon, Wal Mart and Costco are killers to lots of good business'

 

D) Canada specific--a lack of a grocery code of conduct, the fees they charge should be illegal

 

 

I agree about another PCA tragedy     the masterful GFSI scheme forgot that one cannot police themselves, asking would be auditors to essentially work for free in the beginning is never going to draw the best and brightest, and when my business is tied to the 15k I pay for the privilege of a "knowledgeable" and "objective" auditor, the system is designed to fail

 

 

    

[kfromNE]

It's funny/depressing attending all these QA webinars and the speakers are from these big publicly traded companies with lots of financial and personnel support. Inevitably the Q&A will include questions like "What if our company doesn't have a good food safety culture and upper management doesn't care?" and the speaker's answer is "Hmm...That's tough. Luckily, everyone at -company name- is really dedicated :) You just have to tell management how important it is :)"

 

I'd love to see a webinar called "How to Cope with Bad Food Safety Culture When You Can't Leave Your Job Because the Companies That Have a Good Culture Currently Aren't Hiring Or They Are In Nebraska and No Offense But I Don't Want to Move to Nebraska"  

 

This topic was asked when I'm having a good week. Give it a few more weeks and I'll question this industry and my job again. 

[Miss Frankie]

I am going to pi** some people of here i'm sure but what the hedoublehockeysticks

 

A) Millennials at work are a HUGE problem, the first generation of participation awards and not being held back at school   work ethic begins when kiddos are young

 

B) the global economy is a mess  and a large contributing factor to companies pinching ridiculous pennies to try and stay afloat

 

C) Amazon, Wal Mart and Costco are killers to lots of good business'

 

D) Canada specific--a lack of a grocery code of conduct, the fees they charge should be illegal

 

 

I agree about another PCA tragedy     the masterful GFSI scheme forgot that one cannot police themselves, asking would be auditors to essentially work for free in the beginning is never going to draw the best and brightest, and when my business is tied to the 15k I pay for the privilege of a "knowledgeable" and "objective" auditor, the system is designed to fail

 

This SO much!!  Could not agree more!

[ChristinaK]

I am going to pi** some people of here i'm sure but what the hedoublehockeysticks

 

A) Millennials at work are a HUGE problem, the first generation of participation awards and not being held back at school   work ethic begins when kiddos are young

 

B) the global economy is a mess  and a large contributing factor to companies pinching ridiculous pennies to try and stay afloat

 

C) Amazon, Wal Mart and Costco are killers to lots of good business'

 

D) Canada specific--a lack of a grocery code of conduct, the fees they charge should be illegal

 

 

I agree about another PCA tragedy     the masterful GFSI scheme forgot that one cannot police themselves, asking would be auditors to essentially work for free in the beginning is never going to draw the best and brightest, and when my business is tied to the 15k I pay for the privilege of a "knowledgeable" and "objective" auditor, the system is designed to fail

 

Hey now, us millennials are pretty much in our 30's-40's now. The young 20-somethings are Gen Z. :-P

[Scampi]

Sorry Christina--but yes I'm aware but your still the first generation to be told everything you do is GREAT , WONDERFUL and you never disappoint 

 

Clearly not talking to you specifically

 

Case in point-----a 30 something mom where i am got her a 1 day suspension for repeatedly not following GMPs       she FIRMLY believed we needed to "warn her" every time she was found being outside the GMPs procedure           Now, where do you suppose she learned that????  From being told her ENTIRE life that everything she did was GREAT  WONDERFUL and you never disappoint    

 

Oh  I wish I could make this up!

 

The young kids aren't too bad----------they are dead broke and that's one hell of a motivator!

[QAKat]

Sorry Christina--but yes I'm aware but your still the first generation to be told everything you do is GREAT , WONDERFUL and you never disappoint 

 

Clearly not talking to you specifically

 

Case in point-----a 30 something mom where i am got her a 1 day suspension for repeatedly not following GMPs       she FIRMLY believed we needed to "warn her" every time she was found being outside the GMPs procedure           Now, where do you suppose she learned that????  From being told her ENTIRE life that everything she did was GREAT  WONDERFUL and you never disappoint    

 

Oh  I wish I could make this up!

 

The young kids aren't too bad----------they are dead broke and that's one hell of a motivator!

I know it's not specific but I'm 31 and I don't remember anyone ever telling me everything I did was great, wonderful and never disappoint. On the contrary LOL wish I would have been there.  

 

Regardless, I agree. I know a lot of people and have worked with a lot of people from my generation that think everything is going to be handed to them like magic and have also worked with older and younger generations that are the same. 

 

Regarding the actual topic, I'm sorry GMO that you're at that point. For almost 10 years now Iv'e worked in this field and in 99.5% of the jobs I've had I wanted to leave and never do anything relating to QC/QA/food safety again because of the same issues mentioned above by everyone. It's very discouraging to look after a company that is not yours and to have push back on almost everything. I'm doing it for their benefit not mine! Sometimes I would feel like I was part of the decor instead of an actual team. BUT I am still hopeful because fortunately or not I really like what I do     ask me again in a few more years. I might be on the same boat.

[Scotty_SQF]

Oh how I feel so many of these posts.  Good thing we have a group and forum to know we are not alone.

[MDaleDDF]

I am going to pi** some people of here i'm sure but what the hedoublehockeysticks

 

A) Millennials at work are a HUGE problem, the first generation of participation awards and not being held back at school   work ethic begins when kiddos are young

 

B) the global economy is a mess  and a large contributing factor to companies pinching ridiculous pennies to try and stay afloat

 

C) Amazon, Wal Mart and Costco are killers to lots of good business'

 

D) Canada specific--a lack of a grocery code of conduct, the fees they charge should be illegal

 

 

I agree about another PCA tragedy     the masterful GFSI scheme forgot that one cannot police themselves, asking would be auditors to essentially work for free in the beginning is never going to draw the best and brightest, and when my business is tied to the 15k I pay for the privilege of a "knowledgeable" and "objective" auditor, the system is designed to fail

Agreed, and one of the big issues is the NSF certs that were supposed to be the end all be all, aren't.  The idea was I could show that cert and be done.   Now everyone wants to see every bit of my paperwork.

Imagine getting pulled over and the cop asks for your license.   You hand it over.   Then the cop says "what did you score on your driving test?   How many mpg do you average so I can see if you're speeding?   How much air is in your tires?"   Etc etc etc.

Because that's basically what's happening right now.

At some point, I can see just stopping NSF certifications.   Companies are going to throw their hands up and say:   I may as well be doing AIB again, this is pointless.   And honestly AIB did a better and more complete job of actual operations inspections.   All NSF does is look at paperwork basically.....

[t297964]

I needed to read this today!  I have been in the food industry for over 20 years, mostly in food safety/quality.

 

I am so disheartened on where everything is going. 

 

About a year ago, I took on the Quality Control side of our plant along with Food Safety for a "pay raise" which ended up being insultingly low.  I went along with it on the understanding that it would include pay raises for my team that are now getting an additional work load to help me out.  Well, here we sit a year later with no pay raises authorized by my upper management.

 

On top of that, the Food Safety manager for our sister facility (completely different product risk/type) quit and I am just expected to absorb those tasks as well.  I am DROWNING.  

 

Oh, did I mention that we are paying our incoming, new hires off the street for sweeping/cleaning jobs $3 more an hour than we are paying our Quality Techs?  The response I get is that "the lab is temperature controlled, and your team gets bonuses."

 

 

[Scampi]

 

 

Oh, did I mention that we are paying our incoming, new hires off the street for sweeping/cleaning jobs $3 more an hour than we are paying our Quality Techs?  The response I get is that "the lab is temperature controlled, and your team gets bonuses."

 Our production team members got a raise last year, our techs are no longer paid the most------------and they wonder why they are pissy 

 

There are VERY few companies who put any stock in food safety               we are all here because we HAVE to be by law, customer requirements, etc         if they had it their way, our departments wouldn't exist