13 replies to this topic

[Sudais Asif]

Hello, I run a gluten free foods company and we are preparing for FSSC 22000 currently. For HACCP, we have created flowcharts for a range of products, however, they are a bit different from your standard flowcharts since a lot of visualization has been used. I am attaching 2 photos below as an example, would these be acceptable? In your opinion, what disadvantages would it pose compared to traditional flowcharts and anything that auditors may be concerned with?

Attached Files

•  Gulab Jamun Flow CHart.PNG   154.6KB   2 downloads
•  Bread & BUns Flow Chart.PNG   182.42KB   2 downloads

[FSM4you]

Hello, I run a gluten free foods company and we are preparing for FSSC 22000 currently. For HACCP, we have created flowcharts for a range of products, however, they are a bit different from your standard flowcharts since a lot of visualization has been used. I am attaching 2 photos below as an example, would these be acceptable? In your opinion, what disadvantages would it pose compared to traditional flowcharts and anything that auditors may be concerned with?

Hello,

 

IMO, these are a little too informative. I believe they would be acceptable, but I think it opens you up to unnecessary headaches for HACCP violations in the future. My USDA inspector would give us an NR if any part of that was not followed, or done differently then the flowchart states.  

[SQFconsultant]

I go with what FSM4you said and add that as a former Auditor THESE WOULD open up a lot of rabbit holes to be run down that don't need to run down, leading to errors that were not intentional at time of creation - it looks very pretty, but Auditors are not looking for pretty.

 

I'd go the traditional route.

[nwilson]

These seem more like a work instructions flow chart not a HACCP based flow chart.  You should keep things simple and more general in the description of each processing step.  As others have already stated this could be interpreted in a way that would lead to a NC during an audit.  

 

An example:  Mix ingredients --> Create dough --> Form dough balls --> Fry dough balls --? Etc...... Your risk assessment will also be catered and more clear for each step and change in the process.  

[jfrey123]

I don't think there's anything wrong with making it pretty with the pictures, but if you were to review a few publicly searchable examples I think you'll see where you can make some improvements to your flow chart.  Couple things I'm spotting right away:

• The receiving step does not include receiving packaging, nor does it specifically indicate where packaging is introduced into the flow.
• There is no step for storage of raw material or storage of finished goods (I do see a fridge/chiller step with the gulab, but that's prior to packaging so likely only applies to WIP material).  The bread flow chart does not list the receiving step for any ingredients either.
• I speculate that there are some ambient temperature raw ingredients (oils, flours, etc.), and some that likely require refrigeration (eggs).  I normally see flow charts differentiate between cold and ambient receiving and storage, both on the flow chart and hazard analysis.
• If creating either doughs requires water, I'm not seeing water as an input on the flow chart (which should also be included near the receiving part of the flow chart and listed on your HA).
• Bread flow chart does not indicate any CCP's (if there are none then never mind).

[GMO]

What purpose are you trying to make them pretty?  Which audience?  I'd stick to photos in procedures and science in the HACCP plans.

[Scampi]

Those are work flows, not a HACCP flow diagram

 

K.I.S.S. is what you should follow for your flow chart

[Sudais Asif]

These seem more like a work instructions flow chart not a HACCP based flow chart.  You should keep things simple and more general in the description of each processing step.  As others have already stated this could be interpreted in a way that would lead to a NC during an audit.  

 

An example:  Mix ingredients --> Create dough --> Form dough balls --> Fry dough balls --? Etc...... Your risk assessment will also be catered and more clear for each step and change in the process.  

Can you please elaborate on what would differentiate work instructions and haccp based flow charts? From my understanding, a HACCP based flow chart needs to include all steps involved and as others have stated, need not be so detailed but making it detailed should not take away from it being a HACCP flowchart.

 

TIA.

[Sudais Asif]

Those are work flows, not a HACCP flow diagram

 

K.I.S.S. is what you should follow for your flow chart

Why would they not qualify for being HACCP flow diagrams, anything missing? 

 

Asking purely for my understanding, appreciate your response.

[Sudais Asif]

 

I don't think there's anything wrong with making it pretty with the pictures, but if you were to review a few publicly searchable examples I think you'll see where you can make some improvements to your flow chart.  Couple things I'm spotting right away:

• The receiving step does not include receiving packaging, nor does it specifically indicate where packaging is introduced into the flow.
• There is no step for storage of raw material or storage of finished goods (I do see a fridge/chiller step with the gulab, but that's prior to packaging so likely only applies to WIP material).  The bread flow chart does not list the receiving step for any ingredients either.
• I speculate that there are some ambient temperature raw ingredients (oils, flours, etc.), and some that likely require refrigeration (eggs).  I normally see flow charts differentiate between cold and ambient receiving and storage, both on the flow chart and hazard analysis.
• If creating either doughs requires water, I'm not seeing water as an input on the flow chart (which should also be included near the receiving part of the flow chart and listed on your HA).
• Bread flow chart does not indicate any CCP's (if there are none then never mind).

 

Agreed on all points, I will work on those.

 

A question about the water point, wouldn't it fall under the same category of other raw material or is it necessary to list it separately? Asking generally rather than just in the context of the attached examples.

[GMO]

Agreed on all points, I will work on those.

 

A question about the water point, wouldn't it fall under the same category of other raw material or is it necessary to list it separately? Asking generally rather than just in the context of the attached examples.

 

Yes, normally any utilities should be listed separately.  Your control measures on water are unlikely to be similar to other suppliers.

[jfrey123]

A question about the water point, wouldn't it fall under the same category of other raw material or is it necessary to list it separately? Asking generally rather than just in the context of the attached examples.

 

What GMO said.  Unless you're bringing in the water on pallets from a water supplier, it's not receiving the benefit of inspection at receiving with COA's and a LoG to guarantee purity.  The biological hazards for using water from your taps at the plant are addressed through monitoring in your EMP program, something not likely done for raw materials received via truck.

Edited by jfrey123, 30 April 2025 - 04:07 PM.

[nwilson]

Can you please elaborate on what would differentiate work instructions and haccp based flow charts? From my understanding, a HACCP based flow chart needs to include all steps involved and as others have stated, need not be so detailed but making it detailed should not take away from it being a HACCP flowchart.

 

TIA.

 

There is no branch off at any step to show waste, the movement of the materials to the location of processing (such as staging or being stored in a warehouse), or an appropriate call out to CCP's (baking/thermal processing for your bread).  If you are performing a risk assessment for all associated hazards to this process flow then steps are missing and it is incomplete, meaning your risk assessment is not complete either.  As others said where is water coming into this process flow?  

 

This is why I stated that this looks like work instructions.  If you want to include pictures as a visualization aid by all means do so, just make sure you include every step in the process by walking the entire process and documenting it appropriately.  

[GMO]

I have to be honest I agree with all of the other comments.  I'd look at this and have a bit of a reaction along the lines of "WTAF is that meant to add?"

I'm very much of the opinion that HACCP is not an esoteric tool only for Techies, but at the same time, this looks very much like style over substance.

 

After being annoyed, these are the questions I'd ask you as an auditor. 

Flow 1

Cook milk powder, to what temperature / time?

Fry at what temperature / time?  

If the soaking stage is a CCP, what are the parameters?  Why is that unrefrigerated when there is a CCP for refrigeration later?

Is there no labelling step to indicate ingredients including allergens?  No coding?

Where is incoming water and packaging, outgoing waste?

 

Flow 2

 

What is the bake time / temperature?

What temperature are you cooling to?  (Not enough and you risk mould growth.)

Where is the packaging and waster infeed and waste outfeed?

Do you not label and code?

 

Take out the pictures.  What are they adding?  I'm being honest I'd find this really annoying.  I would start delving deep into your HACCP plan as I'd assume the team leader didn't know what they were doing.

[Sudais Asif]

I have to be honest I agree with all of the other comments.  I'd look at this and have a bit of a reaction along the lines of "WTAF is that meant to add?"

I'm very much of the opinion that HACCP is not an esoteric tool only for Techies, but at the same time, this looks very much like style over substance.
 
After being annoyed, these are the questions I'd ask you as an auditor. 

Flow 1

Cook milk powder, to what temperature / time?
Fry at what temperature / time?  
If the soaking stage is a CCP, what are the parameters?  Why is that unrefrigerated when there is a CCP for refrigeration later?
Is there no labelling step to indicate ingredients including allergens?  No coding?
Where is incoming water and packaging, outgoing waste?
 
Flow 2
 
What is the bake time / temperature?
What temperature are you cooling to?  (Not enough and you risk mould growth.)
Where is the packaging and waster infeed and waste outfeed?
Do you not label and code?
 
Take out the pictures.  What are they adding?  I'm being honest I'd find this really annoying.  I would start delving deep into your HACCP plan as I'd assume the team leader didn't know what they were doing.

Thank you for the detailed reply, to answer a few questions:
 
The soaking stage does not involve refrigeration because the Gulab Jamun/Sugar Balls are supposed to soak up the sugar while still hot and by definition of how the sweet is made, refrigerating them would result in a change of texture at this stage. It is defined as a CCP because any microbial growth here would not be fixed later on because their is no other frying kill step afterwards.
 
As for the labelling, we pack these in plain trays which are then dispatched but I have include a packaging & labelling step now which would include adding a manufacturing & expiry date to the tray + mentioning allergens if not all ingredients.
 
For the other points, I have attached a revised flowchart based on feedback from all and you, I would appreciate if you could review it and let me know if it now fills all the checkboxes.
 
Also another question, do flowcharts always need to mention time & temperature for processes?