41 replies to this topic

[Simon]

The Auditor from Tesco / Wallmart is in Reception to conduct an unannounced food safety audit of your plant. How prepared are you?

Please answer the poll and drop your comments below.

Regards,
Simon

[tsmith7858]

Unfortunately, our unannounced audits generally consist of a "scout" running ahead of the auditor to make sure things are in order.

It is better than it was, but there is still room for improvement!

[Simon]

Unfortunately, our unannounced audits generally consist of a "scout" running ahead of the auditor to make sure things are in order.

It is better than it was, but there is still room for improvement!

There's always room for improvement, and continuing on that track is no more than you can do.

I have to thank those who have voted for their honesty. You can kind of see the need for unannounced audits at this rate.

Please vote everyone - let's get to the truth. It's anonymous.

Regards,
Simon

[sskubisnac]

We try and operate on a "30 minute" rule, i.e. never let anything drift away from the ideal that cannot be fixed in the 30 minutes between the auditor arriving on site and hitting the production floor.

[Jo Deakin]

As soon as the auditor arrives; we have a team of people who check to ensure everything is in order and they also inform all concerned that the auditor is on site.

[a_andhika]

Dear Simon,

I choose the: "Somewhat Prepared", the moderate one. Well, IMEX, the 'sudden' audit used to have a 'sudden' result too. Unlike the announced audit, the auditors usually only check the site and wud like to hear one or two words about our system, and sometimes they check the documents too. So, somehow we always manage to get a good result from unannounced adit, for the meantime...


Regards,


Arya

[Simon]

Dear Simon,

I choose the: "Somewhat Prepared", the moderate one. Well, IMEX, the 'sudden' audit used to have a 'sudden' result too. Unlike the announced audit, the auditors usually only check the site and wud like to hear one or two words about our system, and sometimes they check the documents too. So, somehow we always manage to get a good result from unannounced adit, for the meantime...


Regards,


Arya

I think an unannounced audit should be 1 hour maximum to minimise disruption. That's only fair and even I could determine in 1 hour whether a management system was operating effectively. Lunch included.

Regards,
Simon

[Jean]

I would prefer unannounced audits as it helps to be alert at all times. Moreover it should neither be time consuming nor affect the operation.

[tsmith7858]

We had our unannounced audit this week and it was as I stated earlier, everyone running around trying to clean up quick. I actually heard the wispers in the wind before I got the official call to participate in the audit!

The good news is there was not much to clean up and we performed well and passed!

Hopefully next time around everyone will be comfortable enough to realize we don't need to panic because we are doing the right things every day.

[MRios]

It's hard to convince people to do things right AND document what they're doing every day. Unannounced audits sure help with this. Even though they're very stressful while they're happening, at least you don't spend sleepless nights before one of them!
We also have an informal network of "informants" that pass word around of auditors being "in the house". Hopefully pretty soon, we'll have people convinced that they have to their best every day, all day, without having the ghost of Audits Present knocking at our door.

[Abdul Qudoos]

For me 30 min rule is applicable, already the system is in place, good house keeping, hygiene, and safety + documents/records all are up-to-date, we have more than 1 system (ISO 9001 and HACCP, HSE, etc.) and other supplier's audits in place...

So why need to worry!!!

When auditors arrive the news spreads within the premises and everyones responsibility starts to make sure the system is ready and all the requirements in place, there will be a time also when auditors meet management for opening meeting, assistants and supervisors makes records/documents ready by that time.

[Charles.C]

Dear All,

I would like to hear some input from someone who has failed an unannounced audit, i predict a rather less positive response than the previous.

Personally, from a production viewpoint, I always classified such unwelcome activities as equivalent to a giant mosquito bite. And yes, based on my inspectorial experience, every factory has some (at least major) defects, even though they may not always realise it.

Rgds / Charles.C

[Jean]

Dear Charles,

You are right, there is always the other side of unannounced audits which may not be very positive, if hefty fines are levied. There was an incident about few years ago when the unannouced audit was going fine and the usual operational isuess were observed by the auditor like wet and dirty floors in the kitchens at the peak time, handles and shelves dirty (for sure would be cleaned after the operation). But finding one product past the use-by-date changed the scenario dramatically.

[Simon]

Playing devil’s advocate for a change :smile . If I were an auditor I would accept some work in progress and a little untidiness. However, I would not accept any prerequisite GMP failure, missing production records or missing records from monitoring activities of the HACCP plan and CCP’s. To me then if the theoretical documented system that specifies what is required to ensure safe food is not implemented properly (100% of the time) the safety of the food cannot be guaranteed. And that is not good enough.

Needing a week, a day, a couple of hours to get things straight is not acceptable and improvement that is both effective and sustainable is required.

Nearly right is not good enough for food. How would the aviation industry do with this philosophy? Airplanes would be dropping out of the sky every day.

Regards,
Simon

[Madam A. D-tor]

Hello all,

I wonder if there are members of this forum, who are (have been) involved in unannounced BRC audits.
What where your experience?
BRC audits are minimally 1,5 audit days. It seems to me, that unannounced BRC audits, are very hard.

[Simon]

Hello all,

I wonder if there are members of this forum, who are (have been) involved in unannounced BRC audits.
What where your experience?
BRC audits are minimally 1,5 audit days. It seems to me, that unannounced BRC audits, are very hard.

At this stage they are voluntary I believe. I don't imagine there are too many masochists amongst the food safety fraternity. Are there?

[Charles.C]

Dear Madame A. D-tor ,

BRC audits are minimally 1,5 audit days. It seems to me, that unannounced BRC audits, are very hard.

With the exception of Simon's comment, this is surely a globally correct statement. First reaction is to budget for a spy network.

Rgds / Charles.C

[sskubisnac]

Simon,

I understand your point but as we're repeatedly told these days 'assess the risk' .......
One would like to think that the risk to the public from an uncalibrated / faulty weigh scale used for checkweighing a cabbage for instance, would present less of a risk than the sloppy fitting of brakes on a 747!

I would also like to think the level of training amongst aerospace engineers is a tad higher than that given to your average production line operative in a packhouse ....

[Simon]

Simon,

I understand your point but as we're repeatedly told these days 'assess the risk' .......
One would like to think that the risk to the public from an uncalibrated / faulty weigh scale used for checkweighing a cabbage for instance, would present less of a risk than the sloppy fitting of brakes on a 747!

How about the odd operator not washing their hands after a dump, or a dicky metal detector, how about a bit of extra pesticide on the cabbage, maybe a forged internal audit or two.

It's about culture and if you accept nearly right on some things where do you draw the line. Of course genuine mistakes happen, but if you say you do it, do it or at least die trying.

Regards,
Simon

[Eya]

What say you? Please answer the poll and drop your comments below.

Regards,
simon

Not prepared. its really cramming time every time AIB auditors come to our placed. good thing, communication now is easy so once on the gate within minute the "inside" knows his here. But sad part is if he sees someone checking or cleaning the location he is about to inspect that will automatically deduct points for the site.

[Jean]

But sad part is if he sees someone checking or cleaning the location he is about to inspect that will automatically deduct points for the site.

Dear Eya,

I'm quite surprised regarding the above statement. Checking or cleaning is part of any operation and nees to be done always irrespective of any audit or inspection being done, until and unless there is any investigation done for any out breaks or complaints.What is the justification for automatic deduction of points?

[Simon]

I'm quite surprised regarding the above statement. Checking or cleaning is part of any operation and needs to be done always irrespective of any audit or inspection being done, until and unless there is any investigation done for any out breaks or complaints.

You are absolutely right jean

Continual improvement is very important in business and certainly in food safety management systems, but it is usually small incremental steps of improvement. That’s ok but unannounced audits will force a step improvement in those organizations who operate a registered food safety management system. And that’s why it will happen. Unannounced audits will be the norm in all food safety management systems standards soon.

Be Prepared.

Regards,
Simon

[Tony-C]

Once had two seperate auditors turn up for unannounced audits on the same day. The second was politely (Well as polite as I can be in those circumstances) sent away and asked to try another day!

[Charles.C]

Dear Simon,

Unannounced audits will be the norm in all food safety management systems standards soon

I'm not sure if you are just stirring or hv a (receiver's) agenda.

I suppose variables like location might be relevant to the poll (am beginning to think that UK manufacturers never hv anything to hide!?) but personally I would hv added one more option to the polling choices - Initiate standard auditor delay procedure + book usual luncheon location.

Rgds / Charles.C

[Simon]

Dear Simon,



I'm not sure if you are just stirring or hv a (receiver's) agenda.

I suppose variables like location might be relevant to the poll (am beginning to think that UK manufacturers never hv anything to hide!?) but personally I would hv added one more option to the polling choices - Initiate standard auditor delay procedure + book usual luncheon location.

Rgds / Charles.C

Of course I am stirring, but I like to see myself as a bit of a visionary. I see the future and it's a world of unannounced audits.

Regards,
Simon