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Minimal concentration of hydrogen-peroxide for use as a disinfectant for viruses (yes corona virus)?

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#1 Lucas H

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Posted 01 April 2020 - 07:15 PM

Hello,

 

does anyone have good information on the minimal concentration of hydrogen-peroxide for use as a disinfectant for viruses (yes corona virus)?

 

Any sources would be appreciated.

 

I do know that it is used starting from 3% solution for home use and up to 35%, do you have any study, literature or citable information on that?

 

All info is appreciated, if it helps me find anything.

 

Thank you,

 

Lucas

 



#2 The Food Scientist

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Posted 01 April 2020 - 07:41 PM

https://www.ncbi.nlm...v/pubmed/203115

 

https://www.weforum....-safety-health/

 

 

Also check the manufacturer's sheet. The bleach we have actually told us how much is needed to kill human coronavirus. 

 

Hope it helps


Everything in food is science. The only subjective part is when you eat it. - Alton Brown.


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#3 Charles.C

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Posted 01 April 2020 - 09:58 PM

Hello,

 

does anyone have good information on the minimal concentration of hydrogen-peroxide for use as a disinfectant for viruses (yes corona virus)?

 

Any sources would be appreciated.

 

I do know that it is used starting from 3% solution for home use and up to 35%, do you have any study, literature or citable information on that?

 

All info is appreciated, if it helps me find anything.

 

Thank you,

 

Lucas

 

EPA List is at 1st link below but  note the list's sublinked caveat which is partially quoted at end of Post of 2nd link below -

 

https://www.epa.gov/...inst-sars-cov-2

https://www.ifsqn.co...19/#entry157847

 

Also noticed this  -

 

Hydrogen Peroxide
According to the CDC, household (3 percent) hydrogen peroxide is effective in deactivating rhinovirus, the virus that causes the common cold, within 6 to 8 minutes of exposure. Rhinovirus is more difficult to destroy than coronaviruses, so hydrogen peroxide should be able to break down the coronavirus in less time. Pour it undiluted into a spray bottle and spray it on the surface to be cleaned, but let it sit on the surface for at least 1 minute. 

Hydrogen peroxide is not corrosive, so it’s okay to use it on metal surfaces. But similar to bleach, it can discolor fabrics if you accidentally get it on your clothes. “It’s great for getting into hard-to-reach crevices,” Sachleben says. “You can pour it on the area, and you don’t have to wipe it off because it essentially decomposes into oxygen and water.”

 

https://www.consumer...el-coronavirus/


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


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#4 Lucas H

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Posted 02 April 2020 - 05:48 AM

Thank you both for your answers, additional I found a paper I wanted to share which shows some more detailed information.

https://www.journalo...0046-3/fulltext

 

(added) -

 

Attached File  Persistence of coronaviruses on inanimate surfaces and their inactivation with biocidal agents,2020.pdf   200.3KB   40 downloads



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#5 Charles.C

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Posted 02 April 2020 - 05:16 PM

Thank you both for your answers, additional I found a paper I wanted to share which shows some more detailed information.

https://www.journalo...0046-3/fulltext

 

(added) -

 

attachicon.gif Persistence of coronaviruses on inanimate surfaces and their inactivation with biocidal agents,2020.pdf

 

Hi Lucas,

 

Thks for yr reference.

 

JFI, note that the stated (suggested?) inactivation times/concentrations for H2O2 in Posts 4, 3 vary (significantly?), ie

 

(1) : 1min/0.5% (based on data HCoV)

(2) : 2-5min/X%,(based on various data, eg rhinovirus, norovirus)

(3) : 6-8min/3% (based on data rhinovirus)

 

(Note - No.3 is "extrapolated"  from a CDC publication, ie <<< inactivating three serotypes of rhinovirus using a 3% hydrogen peroxide solution was 6–8 minutes; this time increased with decreasing concentrations (18-20 minutes at 1.5%, 50–60 minutes at 0.75%) >>>.

 

Again, should note that, apparently, so far no actual data on SARS-CoV-2 has been published.


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


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#6 Lucas H

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Posted 03 April 2020 - 05:08 PM

Hi Lucas,

 

Thks for yr reference.

 

JFI, note that the stated (suggested?) inactivation times/concentrations for H2O2 in Posts 4, 3 vary (significantly?), ie

 

(1) : 1min/0.5% (based on data HCoV)

(2) : 2-5min/X%,(based on various data, eg rhinovirus, norovirus)

(3) : 6-8min/3% (based on data rhinovirus)

 

(Note - No.3 is "extrapolated"  from a CDC publication, ie <<< inactivating three serotypes of rhinovirus using a 3% hydrogen peroxide solution was 6–8 minutes; this time increased with decreasing concentrations (18-20 minutes at 1.5%, 50–60 minutes at 0.75%) >>>.

 

Again, should note that, apparently, so far no actual data on SARS-CoV-2 has been published.

Yes I did (eventually, but timely :-) ). Fortunatly in the current BCP it doesnt make a difference whether we take one minute or some hours.



#7 Charles.C

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Posted 03 April 2020 - 10:15 PM

Yes I did (eventually, but timely :-) ). Fortunatly in the current BCP it doesnt make a difference whether we take one minute or some hours.

 

Well, I daresay it may matter if one is wiping surfaces.

 

BTW, one needs to be a little careful regarding purity when using H2O2, eg this link -

 

https://www.ifsqn.co...ays/#entry88937


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


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#8 Lucas H

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Posted 04 April 2020 - 02:46 PM

Well, I daresay it may matter if one is wiping surfaces.

 

BTW, one needs to be a little careful regarding purity when using H2O2, eg this link -

 

https://www.ifsqn.co...ays/#entry88937

Yes that is true, but we don't wipe surfaces, I am not too sure what the right English word is but we are using fogging (and indicators to check whether it worked or not).

I needed the information to make sure we are "on the right track" and I was able to sort out some of the offered solution, one of them operating under (!) 0,1 ppm.

Even though on first glance the documentation kind of looked good.



#9 Charles.C

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Posted 04 April 2020 - 05:56 PM

Yes that is true, but we don't wipe surfaces, I am not too sure what the right English word is but we are using fogging (and indicators to check whether it worked or not).

I needed the information to make sure we are "on the right track" and I was able to sort out some of the offered solution, one of them operating under (!) 0,1 ppm.

Even though on first glance the documentation kind of looked good.

 

Fogging is a totally different operation of course, eg -

https://www.cleanroo...m_fogging/52850

 

Appears to require some operational care, eg -

https://www.linkedin...fe-oliver-canty

(also see comments at the end)


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


#10 Lucas H

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Posted 04 April 2020 - 07:36 PM

Fogging is a totally different operation of course, eg -

https://www.cleanroo...m_fogging/52850

 

Appears to require some operational care, eg -

https://www.linkedin...fe-oliver-canty

(also see comments at the end)

 

With our current disinfectants concentration and time is crucial, but with a 3% solution, the time in mentioned in the paper were in the same area as our disinfectants, so no benefit, it didn't go into our decision for general disinfection (not only the paper but also the now available data sheets).

 

But there was an interesting story with the fogging: we had an offer by a supplier, they told us they could get the room "clean" without an evacuation of the room (very tempting).

It may be working, but I seriously doubt it, what’s your opinion?  Is there anything I might have missed? Basically, they told us they could disinfect an area above 10m³ with less than 1,5 l of 2% H2O2 solution (in Water) per day.

I have read some articles about fogging now, but they all used substantially higher concentration with substantially more fogging. – I think it may be fraud.



#11 Charles.C

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Posted 04 April 2020 - 08:39 PM

With our current disinfectants concentration and time is crucial, but with a 3% solution, the time in mentioned in the paper were in the same area as our disinfectants, so no benefit, it didn't go into our decision for general disinfection (not only the paper but also the now available data sheets).

 

But there was an interesting story with the fogging: we had an offer by a supplier, they told us they could get the room "clean" without an evacuation of the room (very tempting).

It may be working, but I seriously doubt it, what’s your opinion?  Is there anything I might have missed? Basically, they told us they could disinfect an area above 10m³ with less than 1,5 l of 2% H2O2 solution (in Water) per day.

I have read some articles about fogging now, but they all used substantially higher concentration with substantially more fogging. – I think it may be fraud.

 

No direct experience unfortunately. The idea has certainly had a long history of development, eg -

https://www.infectio...drogen-peroxide

 

PS - this recent study using 5D reduction of L.mono as an efficiency target seemed quite usefully informative. Illustrates (inter alia) that (a) a variety of H2O2  "delivery" systems are apparently in use, (b) quoted H2O2 concentration measures need to be carefully referenced/defined and (c) that the bactericidal mechanism may be subtle.

 

Attached File  room-disinfection-with-h2o2-mist,2019.pdf   364.06KB   16 downloads


Edited by Charles.C, 05 April 2020 - 12:25 AM.
added PS

Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


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#12 Lucas H

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Posted 05 April 2020 - 08:41 AM

No direct experience unfortunately. The idea has certainly had a long history of development, eg -

https://www.infectio...drogen-peroxide

 

PS - this recent study using 5D reduction of L.mono as an efficiency target seemed quite usefully informative. Illustrates (inter alia) that (a) a variety of H2O2  "delivery" systems are apparently in use, (b) quoted H2O2 concentration measures need to be carefully referenced/defined and (c) that the bactericidal mechanism may be subtle.

 

attachicon.gif room-disinfection-with-h2o2-mist,2019.pdf

 

Thank you for that information, did I correctly understand that they used at least 40 ppm H2O2 as opposed to well below 1ppm of our rejected supplier?

But the study is working with concentrations the approved suppliers use, I think that is a good sign :-)



#13 Charles.C

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Posted 06 April 2020 - 06:04 PM

Thank you for that information, did I correctly understand that they used at least 40 ppm H2O2 as opposed to well below 1ppm of our rejected supplier?

But the study is working with concentrations the approved suppliers use, I think that is a good sign :-)

 

^^^(red) - Yes.

The quoted vapour ppm values are presumably v/v. Interesting that the suggested bactericidal mechanism is liquid driven (ca 10,000ppm).

The process demanded closure of the space.


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


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#14 Esther

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Posted 09 April 2020 - 02:44 PM

Hello,
 
does anyone have good information on the minimal concentration of hydrogen-peroxide for use as a disinfectant for viruses (yes corona virus)?
 
Any sources would be appreciated.
 
I do know that it is used starting from 3% solution for home use and up to 35%, do you have any study, literature or citable information on that?
 
All info is appreciated, if it helps me find anything.
 
Thank you,
 
Lucas

These are the disinfectants an recommendations used in European Union.

Regads

Esther


Edited by Esther, 09 April 2020 - 02:46 PM.


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#15 Esther

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Posted 09 April 2020 - 02:47 PM

These are the disinfectants an recommendations used in European Union.

Regads

Esther



#16 Charles.C

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Posted 10 April 2020 - 10:15 AM

 

These are the disinfectants an recommendations used in European Union.

Regads

Esther

 

 

Hi Esther

Thks for inputs but ^^^^ No data ?

 

 

Re - Spanish approved lactic acid (Post 14) - Does Spain use the same "approval" system as currently used by EPA ?, ie -

 

[Product name] has demonstrated effectiveness against viruses similar to SARS-CoV-2 on hard, nonporous surfaces. Therefore, [product name] can be used against SARS-CoV-2 when used in accordance with the directions for use.

 

https://cen.acs.org/.../98/web/2020/03


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


#17 Esther

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Posted 10 April 2020 - 04:47 PM

Hi Esther

Thks for inputs but ^^^^ No data ?

 

 

Re - Spanish approved lactic acid (Post 14) - Does Spain use the same "approval" system as currently used by EPA ?, ie -

 

https://cen.acs.org/.../98/web/2020/03

Hi Charles. C.

I am glad to say hallo to you after a long time.

I guess you has already found the documents I attarched to the Lucas's question box.

 

Or maybe you are asking for the source of those. Below the links to the two organizaions related to food safey in food premises and biocides approvals:

European Chemicals Agency

https://echa.europa.eu/covid-19

 

European Food Safety Authority

https://www.efsa.europa.eu/es/news/coronavirus-no-evidence-food-source-or-transmission-route

 

Regarding Spain, just say that we are members of the Eurpean Unión so we must follow the European Legislation.

 

On the other hand, I must confess that I had to check on internet what EPA stands for. That is why I send the link to ECHA, the homologous organization, but I can not tell you if the approval system is the same as in EFA. It is said that European Legislation  one of the most ( if not the most) demanding in the world.  Regardless of that what you can do is to check the biocides with effective action for SARS approved in UE and check if they are in the EPA approved list.

 

Thank a lot for your last link. Certainly more time is needed to know better this new virus- But at least we know the family/gender/ category it belong to ( coronavirus). Under that premise the disinfectant used against SARS ( 2002) are being used for this new one .

Regards



#18 Charles.C

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Posted 10 April 2020 - 05:15 PM

Hi Charles. C.

I am glad to say hallo to you after a long time.

I guess you has already found the documents I attarched to the Lucas's question box.

 

Or maybe you are asking for the source of those. Below the links to the two organizaions related to food safey in food premises and biocides approvals:

European Chemicals Agency

https://echa.europa.eu/covid-19

 

European Food Safety Authority

https://www.efsa.europa.eu/es/news/coronavirus-no-evidence-food-source-or-transmission-route

 

Regarding Spain, just say that we are members of the Eurpean Unión so we must follow the European Legislation.

 

On the other hand, I must confess that I had to check on internet what EPA stands for. That is why I send the link to ECHA, the homologous organization, but I can not tell you if the approval system is the same as in EFA. It is said that European Legislation  one of the most ( if not the most) demanding in the world.  Regardless of that what you can do is to check the biocides with effective action for SARS approved in UE and check if they are in the EPA approved list.

 

Thank a lot for your last link. Certainly more time is needed to know better this new virus- But at least we know the family/gender/ category it belong to ( coronavirus). Under that premise the disinfectant used against SARS ( 2002) are being used for this new one .

Regards

 

Hi Esther,

 

Also nice to hear from you.

My apologies that I misinterpreted yr Post 15, thought you were sending some additional documents.

Regardless, yr added links are interesting and will be followed up. Like EPA for you, I have never heard of the European Chemicals Agency. :smile:

 

(EPA have commented they are recommending disinfectants which are capable of eliminating viruses which they consider significantly more resistant than SARS although not seen any actual data to illustrate this.).


Kind Regards,

 

Charles.C


#19 George Adam N

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Posted 16 April 2020 - 01:10 PM

Great, thank you for share

 

EPA List is at 1st link below but  note the list's sublinked caveat which is partially quoted at end of Post of 2nd link below -

 

https://www.epa.gov/...inst-sars-cov-2

https://www.ifsqn.co...19/#entry157847

 

Also noticed this  -

 

https://www.consumer...el-coronavirus/



#20 George Adam N

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Posted 16 April 2020 - 02:07 PM

Thank you for sharing this.. 

 

These are the disinfectants an recommendations used in European Union.

Regads

Esther







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